BX 16V LHM pump
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Thread: BX 16V LHM pump

  1. #1
    Tadpole Nighty89's Avatar
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    Default BX 16V LHM pump

    Hello,
    Let's say i have a 16V with LHM pump running from camshaft, screwed to the gearbox, so same as in XUD9. Is the pump the same (high pressure output on the wheel side) as in diesel, or as in standard XU engines (high pressure output aside the pump)?

    Thanks in advance for reply.

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  2. #2
    Fellow Frogger! frog's Avatar
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    I can't comment on their outputs/pulley sizes, but on the catalogue the diesel and 16V pump have different part numbers, so they're not the same pump even though they mount similarly.


    [Guessing]I would say the differences are mainly to do with where the pump is located on the engine rather than the outputs.
    But aside from that I don't know why the diesel and 16valve pumps would be different if they mount in the same place. Maybe something to do with the different RPM's the engines are capable of. Maybe the diesel pump has a larger pulley? [/Guessing]

    Diesel cars weren't sold locally here so you may have a better chance on the bxclub.co.uk forum. They'll know for sure.

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    Administrator GreenBlood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frog View Post
    [Guessing]I would say the differences are mainly to do with where the pump is located on the engine rather than the outputs.
    But aside from that I don't know why the diesel and 16valve pumps would be different if they mount in the same place. Maybe something to do with the different RPM's the engines are capable of. Maybe the diesel pump has a larger pulley? [/Guessing]

    Diesel cars weren't sold locally here so you may have a better chance on the bxclub.co.uk forum. They'll know for sure.
    [Guessing] Just a thought, doesn't the 16v pump operate in a different direction to other BX pumps, does that also include the Diesel BX?[/Guessing]

    Cheers
    Chris
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    "Déesse" Roland Barthes, 'Mythologies', 1957

    The Déesse has all the characteristics of one of those objects fallen from another universe that fed the mania for novelty in the eighteenth century and a similar mania expressed by modern science fiction: the Déesse is first and foremost the new Nautilus.

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    Fellow Frogger! frog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreenBlood View Post
    [Guessing] Just a thought, doesn't the 16v pump operate in a different direction to other BX pumps, does that also include the Diesel BX?[/Guessing]

    Cheers
    Chris
    Do they? I don't want this to come across argumentative! I'm not arguing, only curious as I can't see why the 16Valve pump would spin the opposite direction to the 8Valve pump. Both the pumps are orientated with their pulley facing the cambelt end of the engine. The crank and both camshafts all spin the same direction. So the spin of the pick up for both pumps is the same (crank and exhaust camshaft), and the orientation of the pump is the same for both, how would they spin the opposite way?
    I know the inlet pipe for the 16Valve pump is in a different place to the 8Valve pump, but I didn't think they spun/operated in different directions.

    Also I'm not sure on the Diesel HP pump, but with my logic it would spin the same as petrol 8Valve and 16Valve pumps.

    Cheers,
    Chris W.

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    Administrator GreenBlood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frog View Post
    Do they? I don't want this to come across argumentative!

    Cheers,
    Chris W.
    You'd never get an argument out of me Chris, I bow to your more informed knowledge

    I was under the impression that the 16v pump was unique to the 16v, but stand corrected

    Cheers
    Chris
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    "Déesse" Roland Barthes, 'Mythologies', 1957

    The Déesse has all the characteristics of one of those objects fallen from another universe that fed the mania for novelty in the eighteenth century and a similar mania expressed by modern science fiction: the Déesse is first and foremost the new Nautilus.

    (Umberto Eco [Ed], The History of Beauty, Rizzoli, NY, 2004)

  6. #6
    Citroën, what else? smiffy1071's Avatar
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    Doesn't the 16v pump sit in a cradle? It's been a while since I last looked under the hood of a 16v car.
    I will take some pictures on Sunday of a 16v, and some pictures of my turbo-d for comparison.
    2005 C5 2.0 VTR Hdi 138, 1986 Kawasaki GPz 750G2

  7. #7
    UFO
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    The BX 16v pump sits behind the engine whilst the 8v pump sits forward of the engine - hence its direction of drive from the belt is opposite. The same pump is used on the 12v XM V6.

    told this story before, but....

    The pump on my XM was failing. I borrowed 2 spare 8v pumps from FatherGoose and set about fitting one to the XM. It mounted and span fine, but was turning opposite direction for its build.

    I sourced a rebuilt pump from Martin Bray, that was marked BX16v and fitted it and it ran perfect.

    I later did some tests on the 8v pump off the car and found that it would suck LHM when turned correct direction but not when turned wrong direction.
    Craig K
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  8. #8
    Administrator GreenBlood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UFO View Post
    The BX 16v pump sits behind the engine whilst the 8v pump sits forward of the engine - hence its direction of drive from the belt is opposite. The same pump is used on the 12v XM V6.

    told this story before, but....

    The pump on my XM was failing. I borrowed 2 spare 8v pumps from FatherGoose and set about fitting one to the XM. It mounted and span fine, but was turning opposite direction for its build.

    I sourced a rebuilt pump from Martin Bray, that was marked BX16v and fitted it and it ran perfect.

    I later did some tests on the 8v pump off the car and found that it would suck LHM when turned correct direction but not when turned wrong direction.


    Cheers
    Chris
    74 D(very Special) >>Rejuvenation Thread<<
    08 C5 X7 HDi very Noir



    "Déesse" Roland Barthes, 'Mythologies', 1957

    The Déesse has all the characteristics of one of those objects fallen from another universe that fed the mania for novelty in the eighteenth century and a similar mania expressed by modern science fiction: the Déesse is first and foremost the new Nautilus.

    (Umberto Eco [Ed], The History of Beauty, Rizzoli, NY, 2004)

  9. #9
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UFO View Post
    The BX 16v pump sits behind the engine whilst the 8v pump sits forward of the engine - hence its direction of drive from the belt is opposite. The same pump is used on the 12v XM V6.

    told this story before, but....

    The pump on my XM was failing. I borrowed 2 spare 8v pumps from FatherGoose and set about fitting one to the XM. It mounted and span fine, but was turning opposite direction for its build.

    I sourced a rebuilt pump from Martin Bray, that was marked BX16v and fitted it and it ran perfect.

    I later did some tests on the 8v pump off the car and found that it would suck LHM when turned correct direction but not when turned wrong direction.
    I just discovered the same thing with the ID19 .... The pump will pump fine in the wrong direction, but *not* suck. Given the reseviour is lower than the pump in a "D" it just wouldn't prime If you held the feed higher than the pump and filled it with LHM the pump would work perfectly

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  10. #10
    1000+ Posts Ken W's Avatar
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    Hey Frog,

    I think we need some videos to sort this direction of turning out.

    Cheers,

    Ken W

  11. #11
    Fellow Frogger! frog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ken W View Post
    Hey Frog,

    I think we need some videos to sort this direction of turning out.

    Cheers,

    Ken W
    They both spin clockwise if you were looking straight on to the front of the pulley.



    Edit: Also, Smiffy pictures of the turbo D would be awesome thanks.
    Last edited by frog; 12th February 2012 at 11:46 AM.

  12. #12
    1000+ Posts George 1/8th's Avatar
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    Default pump direction

    Hi Froggers,
    just to add confusion, I have an old CX pump in a rig I built up for sphere pressure testing, and in this I can turn the pump handle by hand in either direction and it works, I can even just rock the handle back and forth about 1/4 of a turn and it still pumps!.. Just an amazing pump I guess.
    This is probably no help to anyone, I just thought you'd all like to know.

    Cheers....George 1/8th

  13. #13
    Fellow Frogger! frog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by George 1/8th View Post
    Hi Froggers,
    just to add confusion, I have an old CX pump in a rig I built up for sphere pressure testing, and in this I can turn the pump handle by hand in either direction and it works, I can even just rock the handle back and forth about 1/4 of a turn and it still pumps!.. Just an amazing pump I guess.
    This is probably no help to anyone, I just thought you'd all like to know.

    Cheers....George 1/8th
    George, we have a rig built by Ken W that sounds exactly the same.

  14. #14
    Administrator GreenBlood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frog View Post
    They both spin clockwise if you were looking straight on to the front of the pulley.
    Nice work thanks Chris, it's hard to tell the rotation in the video, but the 8v is definitely clockwise but the 16v is at a speed where it does that backwards forwards thing - but you have clearly seen they turn in the same direction 'clockwise' 'nuff said.

    Why there are claims to the contrary by respected specialists in Brisbane, and UFO's experience - well that's another story

    Thanks for going to the trouble - good stuff

    Cheers
    Chris
    74 D(very Special) >>Rejuvenation Thread<<
    08 C5 X7 HDi very Noir



    "Déesse" Roland Barthes, 'Mythologies', 1957

    The Déesse has all the characteristics of one of those objects fallen from another universe that fed the mania for novelty in the eighteenth century and a similar mania expressed by modern science fiction: the Déesse is first and foremost the new Nautilus.

    (Umberto Eco [Ed], The History of Beauty, Rizzoli, NY, 2004)

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