Can you drive a C5 with one wheel missing?
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  1. #1
    Tadpole
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    Default Can you drive a C5 with one wheel missing?

    Well that says it all. Can you drive a C5 with one wheel off? Is there any special preparation needed if venturing into this project?
    Ours has been driven unknowingly with a shredded front tyre. My wife only discovered it by investigating a strange noise which sounded like a stick caught up. It had no discernible feeling in the steering.
    Ross

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    1000+ Posts jo proffi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RossandJanice View Post
    Well that says it all. Can you drive a C5 with one wheel off? Is there any special preparation needed if venturing into this project?
    Ours has been driven unknowingly with a shredded front tyre. My wife only discovered it by investigating a strange noise which sounded like a stick caught up. It had no discernible feeling in the steering.
    Ross
    What an odd post.
    Sounds like you are attempting to have two wheels missing, a driving wheel and the spare.
    If you were to make a tricycle (which sounds like a really dumb idea) you'd have two on the front and one on the rear.



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    the famous 18E pug206gti's Avatar
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    g'day,
    I drive the 180 without a spare, is that the same ?
    A quick aside... when watching a band on stage, how can you tell if the stage is level

    regards,
    Les W.


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    Thank God for my Hydroen harrisson_citroen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RossandJanice View Post
    Well that says it all. Can you drive a C5 with one wheel off? Is there any special preparation needed if venturing into this project?
    Ours has been driven unknowingly with a shredded front tyre. My wife only discovered it by investigating a strange noise which sounded like a stick caught up. It had no discernible feeling in the steering.
    Ross
    With the DS you could drive on 3 wheels quite well, but I think only if it was the rear wheel missing.

    I would be surprised if you could drive a C5 with a front wheel missing. But I'm happy to be corrected anytime.
    At the price the early ones are now selling for, I guess it wouldn't be a great loss to try it, and find out you can't!
    DS Un jour, DS toujours !

  5. #5
    Tadpole
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    I think the point is being missed. Some Citroens can be driven on only 3 wheels. There are some Youtubes showing it, but they are pretty poor quality.
    Ross

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    Fellow Frogger
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    Try it and let us know!

    I always thought you needed to have the suspension at the maximum height and against the bump stops for that DS trick to work. I would work on a DS if you lost a rear wheel, because so much weight is over the front. The C5 is most likely less front-heavy, but that's a guess rather than a fact.

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    Decades ago members of the CCCQ drove through a country town ( Stanthorpe if I recall correctly ) with several Ds on three wheels. It can be done in normal height if a suitable wedge is placed to limit the downward stroke of a rear trailing arm....wedge going atop the lower bump stop. It was of course done at 'procession" speed .. a term used by Daimler drivers ! The wedge stops the brake backing drum from hitting the ground and the car just self levels.

    I have had a rear tyre self destruct with no deviation from the chosen line. ( It was a Bandag cold retread ... beloved by the big truck guys at the time, and maybe still ?? ... and performed by the local Michelin distributors at the time..... Boral. Back then Michelin tyres were always unobtainable...Boral never had stock in Citroen sizes in Brisbane, and whenever I'd try to get Xs they only had XAs and vice versa )

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    JBN
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    I had two BX rear tyres spiked through the sidewalls in an act of vandalism by a person or persons unknown (that's why I am not writing this from gaol).

    I replaced one with the spare and left the other one off. Drove on maximum height (ie no suspension) and still managed to dent the backing plate rounding a corner. Apart from the cost of new tyres, I also had to pay a further $30 for a used backing plate.

    On a 2CV, a flat rear tyre or indeed a front tyre seems to have no effect on gravel roads, but they are a dumb car, not the sharpest tool in the Citroen shed, and don't know any better. Also, their soft steel rims are easier to beat back into a round shape with a brick bolster ground to reflect the original curve of the rim.

    John

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    Fellow Frogger! Ronhic's Avatar
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    Ross,

    Historically, some hydraulically suspended Citroens could be driven with a rear wheel missing - a fact played upon by Citroen in period advertising and a feature often given credit for saving the life of President De Gaulle in the early 1960's.

    Effectively, the rear wheel diagonally opposite the driver is removed and with the suspension on the second highest setting, away you go. I've put a clip in for you to watch of a GS advert demonstrating it (love the engine note!).

    However, moving back to the recent past, from what I understand modern hyraulically suspended Citroens (from the BX?) are unable to do the same thing.

    Now, that the driver of the car was unable to detect something wrong with the FRONT wheel until a noise was heard is, in my humble opinion, no bad thing. What that tells me is that the car was behaving 'as it should' - not scaring the driver with wayward behaviours which could have caused a nasty accident. As an example, my father was driving my Renault 12 up the Clyde one Sunday afternoon about 25 years ago when we ended up behind a truck. We could hear flapping and put it down to the canvas covering on the truck's trailer. We overtook and the noise was still there. Pulling over we found one nearly shredded Michelin and a very hot wheel on the left front side of the car.

    Dad had no idea that there was a tyre on its way out.

    Put it down to good suspension design and solid engineering....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YhuEoX_y0qY

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    UFO
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    I have seen video and/or photos of it being done with DS, GS and CX. I would be loath to try it with anything later.
    Last edited by UFO; 4th January 2012 at 10:24 AM.
    Craig K
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    1000+ Posts michaelr's Avatar
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    This is not quite what you meant, but interesting. It suggests it might be possible.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sxm8kzQGhyc
    Michael
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    1000+ Posts gerry freed's Avatar
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    I have driven DS deliberately and accidently with one wheel removed and it works fine but will scuff the brake drum. It is best done with the rear wheel opposite the driver removed. It is tricky if you try it without the steering wheel.

    On one occasion I had parked our DS on shore just out of site of our mooring on the Paramatta river. In motoring out in the dinghy, I accidently fouled the lines of some ethnic fisherman who swore in an unknown language, perhaps Turkish. On our return in the evening we found that these vindictive gentlemen has removed the valves on the front and rear wheels hidden from the waterside.
    I hope they were watching as I put the spare on the front axle, removed the rear wheel and drove off to find a garage with valves. On the way several drivers hooted, shouted and pointed to the bare drum. One stopped along side at traffic lights, very agitated. I reassured him that I often drove like that as is saves tyre wear and 1/4 of the petrol consumption.
    Is he still wondering?
    Anyway don't try it on a C5, the ABS whinges and the disks get damaged.
    Think Global - Ride on Spheres

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    In a DS, you don't notice the loss of a front wheel. Well, you would eventually, because the car would slow down! On the Newell Highway south of Dubbo in my 1959 DS19 I had just gone over a railway crossing and suddenly noticed a wheel rolling along merrily out the driver's door window. I slowed down gingerly and pulled over. The whole time I felt nothing untoward. The front right wheel had come off. Some loser had obviously not tightened it properly. I searched for and found the wheel in the bush on the other side of the highway. Luckily there was no oncoming traffic! I was able to jack up the right side of the car in the normal way, despite the lack of a wheel on the hub. Inspection revealed the lower ball joint nut had been completely worn away by the bitumen. I hoped the taper would hold for the trip back to Bendigo; it did. Back went the wheel and we all lived happily ever after.

    The people in the following four wheel drive stopped to help, greatly alarmed by my predicament. They were gobsmacked by the good behaviour of the dS and the insouciant way in which I single-handedly dealt with the problem using no special equipment and went on my way.

    I have told this story several times in the pages and I think it bears repeating.

    Roger

    PS Craig, in this instance the word you want is loath. Loath = unwilling; loathe = detest.

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    Fellow Frogger!
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    One stopped along side at traffic lights, very agitated. I reassured him that I often drove like that as is saves tyre wear and 1/4 of the petrol consumption.
    Is he still wondering?


    Love it

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    Quote Originally Posted by pug206gti View Post
    g'day,

    A quick aside... when watching a band on stage, how can you tell if the stage is level

    When the drummer is dribbling evenly out of both sides of his mouth! (Boom Boom!)

    Oh, and RossandJanice, a DS can be driven without a back wheel as noted. I've done it myself a couple of times.

    As for a C5 without a front wheel, as also noted, you may not feel it until destruction has set in, but I suggest it'd be difficult and inadvisable.

    Cheers, Pottsy
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    Fellow Frogger!
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    I have seen video and/or photos of it being done with DS, GS and CX. I would be loath to try it with anything later.
    Hard-case Citroenistas at play .. Xantia tripod parking up behind a similarly bereft GSA

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKC5d4Ytcq0

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    Hey Gerry I'm no expert but how do you know the Turks fouled your valves?!!
    No offence ; )
    Steven

    When I lived in Potrs Point people often attacked my DSpecial, idiots

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    1000+ Posts Greg C's Avatar
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    I think it would work on any hydropneumatic Citroen. You can drive on 3 wheels because

    1. the Suspension self levels and can be set at various ride heights
    2. There is massive forward weight bias. In the case of the CX almost 70% over the front wheels.

    Therefore the missing wheel must be from the rear. I can't see why the C5 could not do the trick as it meets the 2 criteria.

    One evening I got a flat on the Putty road because I noticed a slightly different feel going around a corner and it was slight. If I had been going on a straight road I wouldn't have known it until the tyre was in shreds.

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    Fellow Frogger! FedGrapes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gerry freed View Post
    I have driven DS deliberately and accidently with one wheel removed and it works fine but will scuff the brake drum. It is best done with the rear wheel opposite the driver removed. It is tricky if you try it without the steering wheel.

    On one occasion I had parked our DS on shore just out of site of our mooring on the Paramatta river. In motoring out in the dinghy, I accidently fouled the lines of some ethnic fisherman who swore in an unknown language, perhaps Turkish. On our return in the evening we found that these vindictive gentlemen has removed the valves on the front and rear wheels hidden from the waterside.
    I hope they were watching as I put the spare on the front axle, removed the rear wheel and drove off to find a garage with valves. On the way several drivers hooted, shouted and pointed to the bare drum. One stopped along side at traffic lights, very agitated. I reassured him that I often drove like that as is saves tyre wear and 1/4 of the petrol consumption.
    Is he still wondering?
    Anyway don't try it on a C5, the ABS whinges and the disks get damaged.


    Probably one of the best things I've ever read!

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    The rear track width of earlier Citroens is much narrower than newer Pug based models. Newer models are as wide at the back as they are at the front unlike a GS so I wouldn't try it with a C5.

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    1000+ Posts gerry freed's Avatar
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    Purely on the basis of probability and I can't confirm they were Turkish. There was no one else around. I had tried to apologise but they didn't seem to understand me either. We parked there all weekend every weekend for several months and never saw them before or after.
    We were parked at the end of Charlton St, Hen and Chicken Bay and moored on the other side of the Bay.
    Yo has just added some more input. We used to carry an inflatable on the roof of the Safari. She remembers their resentment as we launched the boat over the small sea wall where they were fishing and the difficulty we had in avoiding their lines. It wasn't a spot where people normally fished and she also recalls that there was noone else around.
    Thinking further about it, it had to be someone who knew where we were and deliberately went to the other side of the car where they would have been in sight of a couple of houses. A more random vandal would have gone onto the water facing side where they would have felt unlikely to be overlooked.
    The citizens of Potts Point, I can fully appreciate.
    Quote Originally Posted by forumnoreason View Post
    Hey Gerry I'm no expert but how do you know the Turks fouled your valves?!!
    No offence ; )
    Steven

    When I lived in Potrs Point people often attacked my DSpecial, idiots
    Last edited by gerry freed; 5th January 2012 at 01:01 AM.
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    1000+ Posts bigkev414's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RossandJanice View Post
    Well that says it all. Can you drive a C5 with one wheel off? Is there any special preparation needed if venturing into this project?
    Ours has been driven unknowingly with a shredded front tyre. My wife only discovered it by investigating a strange noise which sounded like a stick caught up. It had no discernible feeling in the steering.
    Ross
    Yes you can provided it's the spare.:

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    1000+ Posts bigkev414's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gerry freed View Post
    Purely on the basis of probability and I can't confirm they were Turkish. There was no one else around. I had tried to apologise but they didn't seem to understand me either. We parked there all weekend every weekend for several months and never saw them before or after.
    We were parked at the end of Charlton St, Hen and Chicken Bay and moored on the other side of the Bay.
    Yo has just added some more input. We used to carry an inflatable on the roof of the Safari. She remembers their resentment as we launched the boat over the small sea wall where they were fishing and the difficulty we had in avoiding their lines. It wasn't a spot where people normally fished and she also recalls that there was noone else around.
    The citizens of Potts Point, I can fully appreciate.
    We lived at Cabarita with views over Hen and Chicken bay for years and Cabarita Park was full of Turkish Muslim people picnicking every weekend. They actively discouraged anybody else using the park, and I know they were Turks because one of my employees was from Iraq and he told me they were quote :Turkish wogs, not Arab wogs like me: unquote. Therefor I concur with Gerry on the probability stakes, HOWEVER before we lived there we lived in Brenan Street Lilyfield and some swines pinched BOTH back wheels of my Holden panel van which was parked outside the house under a tree while I was having lunch inside! Bastards. Probably Italians because we were the only non Italians in the suburb.

  24. #24
    1000+ Posts gerry freed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg C View Post
    I think it would work on any hydropneumatic Citroen. You can drive on 3 wheels because

    1. the Suspension self levels and can be set at various ride heights
    2. There is massive forward weight bias. In the case of the CX almost 70% over the front wheels.

    Therefore the missing wheel must be from the rear. I can't see why the C5 could not do the trick as it meets the 2 criteria.

    One evening I got a flat on the Putty road because I noticed a slightly different feel going around a corner and it was slight. If I had been going on a straight road I wouldn't have known it until the tyre was in shreds.

    The joys of driving Citroens
    The problem is not the stability but secondary effects. Without a wheel in place as the other wheel moves with the road surface so the suspension moves the exposed disk or drum slightly out of phase and it hits the road. On the drums it chips bits off the flange. The ABS when the brakes are applied discovers that the disk is not rotating and concludes that the wheel has locked and compensates accordingly which may not be what you want.
    You are best reserving this trick for meetings on soft ground and nothing later than a DS.
    I have another tale to tell on the subject.
    I was driving my 1959 supercharged iD down Staines High Street, not far from Slough in fairly busy afternoon traffic. I slowed down to avoid the car in front and a wheel rolled by on my inside. Fascinated I watched it steer its way past several cars until it turned up a ramp on a zebra crossing and laid down alongside the yellow beacon post. Then I saw that it had a central bolt fixing and it slowly dawned on me that it might be mine. I stopped and sure enough I was happily driving on three wheels and was quite unaware that it had left the car.
    Then I remembered that a few days earlier I had been showing off the rear wheel access to some mates at work and rushed the replacement when it had started to rain. I probably hadn't tightened the bolt enough.
    On a later DS, I was driving up the M1 and stopped for a coffee. As I got out I saw that a rear wing was missing, which I put down to not tightening its bolt up properly when showing off some similar manoeuvre. Then a truckie came into the cafť, swearing in very English manner about the bastard who nearly killed him because half his car came off and wrapped itself around his windscreen.
    We crept out and raced off north.
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  25. #25
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Quote Originally Posted by RossandJanice View Post
    Well that says it all. Can you drive a C5 with one wheel off? Is there any special preparation needed if venturing into this project?
    Ours has been driven unknowingly with a shredded front tyre. My wife only discovered it by investigating a strange noise which sounded like a stick caught up. It had no discernible feeling in the steering.
    Ross
    Impossible to drive a C5 on three wheels, car is too wide, can't be done. Proof, jack it up, take a wheel off and let it down. Caution, make sure the dog hasn't camped underneath.

    On another note, probably Bflat, but anyone remember the Triumph Herald? you could drive that on three wheels providing the brake was locked on the missing wheel hub first. And there's others, but why?. Nonsense all of it.

    No reaction from the steering is testament to the excellent steering geometry. The same configuration is widely used on most European and increasingly some Asian cars these days, works well but is a well proven tire scrubber. Probably came from the design department at Michelin after WW11 as a way of overcoming the slump in tire sales due to the exorbitant cost of concrete reinforcing steel. Nonsense all of it.

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