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  1. #1
    mnm
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    Default DS Lucas tail lights

    Hi there

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    I've got two pics here for your perusal. I realise both are decapotables but my interest is in the Lucas tail lights. My D Special has the twin pair of red Lucas lights like the red one here. The Silver one has the extra reversing lights as well.. is this a factory fit?

    I'd like to replicate the same triple look on my D but the mounting plate isn't long enough, so I'm trying to figure out how to go about it. Any thoughts?

    Thanks

    Matthew
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails DS Lucas tail lights-4664073106_482132a9e1_b.jpg   DS Lucas tail lights-4779705344_71312ef90a_b.jpg  

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    1000+ Posts daffyduck's Avatar
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    Those lights were standard on Chapron and US spec cars.
    To fit them, you need the panel that goes behind the bumper. Ocasionally, you see the parts you need offered on ebay.

    The car with the three lenses is probably a 1969.

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    mnm
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    So is the panel you refer to a separate piece which the lenses mount to (ie one each side) and is then mounted to the number plate panel that runs the length of the bumper.?

    Thanks

    Matthew

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    1000+ Posts daffyduck's Avatar
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    There is one panel that bolts to the rear of the trunk. The mounts to the body are the same, but the lenses can't be swapped between panels without butchering something on the biggest panel that spans almost the width of the tail end of the car.
    There are two other, separate panels that hold the lights and they bolt to that.
    The light holder panels are different (longer/shorter/three bulbs/two bulbs) based on country of sale and year of manufacture. Notice that some panels put the license lamps right next to the US license plate, and others do not.

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    Thank God for my Hydroen harrisson_citroen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mnm View Post
    Hi there

    I've got two pics here for your perusal. I realise both are decapotables but my interest is in the Lucas tail lights. My D Special has the twin pair of red Lucas lights like the red one here. The Silver one has the extra reversing lights as well.. is this a factory fit?

    I'd like to replicate the same triple look on my D but the mounting plate isn't long enough, so I'm trying to figure out how to go about it. Any thoughts?

    Thanks

    Matthew
    The DSpecial in Australia never wore those lights. They look great, but you may have to face the wrath of the all-knowing bearded Citroen Clan by installing them on a DSpecial.

    Also you may lose value in the process as the asking price of original un-molested DSpecials is rising rapidly as they are getting harder to find. Hybrid models are always worth less.

    Although if you intend keeping your car ,then it's your business, isn't it?
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    mnm
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    Here's the back of my car.. it must be an import.. ignore my crazy niece by the way As you can see someone has added those hideous trailer clear lenses which is why I thought the clear version of the Lucas light would look better but mounted next to the brake light like the Chapron car..


    I hear what you say about originality.. I had planned on making it my own however, so no thoughts of moving on at this stage. I did the same thing with my 76 beetle.. in effect creating what I considered the ultimate beetle..selling it now but I have adored driving it these last ten years as every part of it was to my taste.

    I'm always open to suggestions though so i appreciate any input.

    Matthew
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails DS Lucas tail lights-100_0363.jpg  

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    Thank God for my Hydroen harrisson_citroen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mnm View Post
    Here's the back of my car.. it must be an import.. ignore my crazy niece by the way As you can see someone has added those hideous trailer clear lenses which is why I thought the clear version of the Lucas light would look better but mounted next to the brake light like the Chapron car..


    I hear what you say about originality.. I had planned on making it my own however, so no thoughts of moving on at this stage. I did the same thing with my 76 beetle.. in effect creating what I considered the ultimate beetle..selling it now but I have adored driving it these last ten years as every part of it was to my taste.

    I'm always open to suggestions though so i appreciate any input.

    Matthew
    You're RHD so I think it more likely someone has installed those lights previously on a standard Australian D and I think they suit the D perfectly. and they are Citroen anyway, so....
    So I think it's really up to you as it is your car anyway.
    By the way I think my son would think there is nothing wrong with your niece.
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    DS
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    I've always suspected that the cars in this country with those lights were private imports all bought under the scheme of "buy and drive Europe" then bring it home with you. Many years ago a founding CCCNSW member gave us a great slide night of the pics he took from collecting his DS21 at the Paris factory through to the drive around Europe and then having the car shipped home.

    Here is a shot I took many years ago at CitIn Lake Eildon of two 1970 DS21 with the EFI car having those lights. Pic here http://www.flickr.com/photos/frontdrive34/2641635958 The EFI car still lives in Sydney to the same owner of 25+ years.

    David G in Melbourne owns a Slough production 1961? DS19 with the triple lights. Pic here http://www.flickr.com/photos/frontdrive34/2640633443

    I'd agree that someone has added the "trailer" reverse lights here. Clever spot to block the number plate lights! Why not remove them and fit original look under bumper reverse lights?

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    Quote Originally Posted by DS View Post
    I've always suspected that the cars in this country with those lights were private imports all bought under the scheme of "buy and drive Europe" then bring it home with you. Many years ago a founding CCCNSW member gave us a great slide night of the pics he took from collecting his DS21 at the Paris factory through to the drive around Europe and then having the car shipped home.
    Ah yes, and I guess he picked up his RHD car at the Paris factory with French rego on it , did he?
    Not possible.
    Let me explain, it was never possible to drive out of a French factory therefore with rego in a RHD.
    So if he did that,it must have been a left hand drive one and when he shipped it home, he could not register it there, except n the ACT.
    Good story but important elements missing or confused.
    Last edited by harrisson_citroen; 11th March 2011 at 06:22 PM.
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    How hard can it be to find either new,or second hand rectangular reversing lights(the correct type) for DS23 cars ?. My 1975 DS 32 Pallas ,had the original reversing lights removed,by the PO,because he decided to install a tow bar similar to Matthews car,and when that happens the reversing lights have to be removed,(the main cross bar is mounted directly under the bumper bar),and so the PO replaced the original reversing lights,with these hideous Japanese square lights,mounted directly on brackets on the cross bar. When I asked him what happened to the original reversing lights prior to selling the car to me,his response was vague ,and could not rememberr where they were,so now I just have to put up with these horrible lights that he mounted on the tow bar. Joe
    1975 Citroen DS 23 Pallas

  11. #11
    1000+ Posts michaelr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mnm View Post
    Here's the back of my car.. it must be an import..
    Matthew
    Yes, a number of things you have mentioned about your car point to it being an import, probably a used private import from the UK by an immigrant.

    I think the UK spec lights look good and the triple light arrangement makes good sense too. It would not be hard to make a custom light panel to take the Lucas lights. If you remove the rear bumper bar you will see the panel held to the rear face of the boot fastened with four bolts accessible from the inside.
    Michael
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    In the past: Renault 750, Dauphine, R4, R8, R10, Peugeot 504 Familiale, ID 19 (x2), Safari (x2)

  12. #12
    mnm
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    I'd agree that someone has added the "trailer" reverse lights here. Clever spot to block the number plate lights! Why not remove them and fit original look under bumper reverse lights?[/QUOTE]

    I think the Lucas lights look cool.. more like a rocket ship!! If only the performance matched! That's why I was interested in the round clear lenses instead of the rectangular ones.

  13. #13
    DS
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    harrisson_citroen

    NO he did actually pick up a RHD car with local rego. Calling me a liar?

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    Quote Originally Posted by DS View Post
    harrisson_citroen

    NO he did actually pick up a RHD car with local rego. Calling me a liar?
    Definitely not calling you anything like that.
    It's just that you cannot register a car in France with the steering wheel on the wrong side. Just as you can't register a car in NSW with the steering wheel on the left. So no, something doesn't add up.
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    UFO
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    I too know of another D, a safari in fact, that was collected from the factory in Paris, driven in Europe, based in the UK for some time then shipped back to Australia many years ago when the Australian Army Lieutenant and his family returned to Australia.

    Boyracer also knows about the car and Rohnic and DS would have seen it under cover at a western Sydney workshop just recently.

    By the way, the safari in question is RHD.
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    Quote Originally Posted by UFO View Post
    I too know of another D, a safari in fact, that was collected from the factory in Paris, driven in Europe, based in the UK for some time then shipped back to Australia many years ago when the Australian Army Lieutenant and his family returned to Australia.

    Boyracer also knows about the car and Rohnic and DS would have seen it under cover at a western Sydney workshop just recently.

    By the way, the safari in question is RHD.
    Hey, hey guys, hold your horses there.

    The fact that you have seen those cars and the fact you heard those stories, I don't deny. It is just that somewhere along the lines something has been missed. Maybe the cars where originally delivered in England then shipped to Paris or whatever.
    It doesn't detract from the fact that you WILL NOT register a car in France that is RHD. You couldn't then and you can't now.

    I will now tell you a story, especially for the Sydney Guys.:
    The DS pallas in my possession was bought fom a Sydneysider who moved to Brisbane.
    Hefirmly believed this car came from the French government inNoumea. I am sure you know of the car as it was well known in Sydney.. He also believed this car was used by De Gaulle when he visited New Caledonia. There is a short article in your club magazine in NSW from a few years back that relates to this car belonging to DeGaulle. I knewfrom the start it was [email protected]

    1-The carwas RHD. NO Government car in Noumea are RHD.
    2- French official government cars are either Navy blue or black.
    3- But best of all was the fact that DE Gaulle died in 1970 and the car was only built in 1974. But despite these uncontournable facts, I wasn't able to convince the seller this wasn't De Gaulle's car.

    Just to illustrate that sometime good rumours don't stand up to close scrutiny.
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    DS
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    Arthur and Carol used a later version of this scheme (see the National Geographic ads for the US market).

    I fully accept that the New Caledonia story is very wrong, totally, BUT Arthur and Carols car, well I've seen the slides of the owners, the car all shot on the day of collection of their DS21 RHD taken in Paris. It did happen.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails DS Lucas tail lights-file0001.jpg   DS Lucas tail lights-file0002.jpg  
    Last edited by DS; 11th March 2011 at 10:44 PM.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by DS View Post
    Arthur and Carol used a later version of this scheme (see the National Geographic ads for the US market).

    I fully accept that the New Caledonia story is very wrong, totally, BUT Arthur and Carols car, well I've seen the slides of the owners, the car all shot on the day of collection of their DS21 RHD taken in Paris. It did happen.

    Well, I'll have to believe you then won't I (although the pictures show it LHD)
    In the meantime I have checked with DRIRE the French rego outfit, and you can actually NOW register a RHD in France if the vehicle passes the recently agreed on European norms. So my info was a little out ofdate but In the past it was a complete impossibillity.

    All in the quest for the truth.
    Cheers
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    DS
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    (although the pictures show it LHD)
    Of course those pictures show LHD. They are ads for the US market which drives on which side?

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    DS
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    There are several types of round lights.

    Are these french plastic here http://www.flickr.com/photos/epaves68/2471667165/

    and dirty english LUCAS plastic here http://www.flickr.com/photos/gfimages/4217097942/

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    Thank God for my Hydroen harrisson_citroen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DS View Post
    Of course those pictures show LHD
    What the.....
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    DS's first picture (French plastic?) is of Lucas lights as fitted to Slough cars. They are almost conical, with 4 plastic fins and a chromed surrounding trim. Early cars had only two red ones on each side and a pair of number plate lamps on the inboard side of them, but from about 1960 a third, clear, reversing lamp was added, and a single number plate light below the plate was used instead. On Slough cars the rear indicators in the trumpets were the same pattern, although the earliest cars (certainly the ones with "Trumpets of Jericho") had French indicator lights).

    DS's second picture (dirty Lucas English plastic) may well be Lucas and English and plastic, but they are not the type fitted to Slough cars. They are flatter, and have neither fins nor chromed surrounds. Maybe they were fitted to American market cars or Chapron cars or whatever, but I have not seen them fitted to any common-or-garden Slough cars.

    Roger

  23. #23
    mnm
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    Well then.. my car has the Lucas lights as in the second picture (dirty?) and they have a chrome base as well?? I've actually bought some replacements for the restoration.. from a guy in the UK.. so they won't be "dirty" anymore. They are a complete unit.. chrome base, wires and lens.

    Matthew

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    BVH Roger Wilkinson's Avatar
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    The lights fitted to Slough cars do not have a chrome base. They have a chrome trim around the plastic lens. It comes off when you remove the lens. The lens mounts by a bayonet fitting.

    Roger

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    mnm
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    OK. Well here are two pics of the CitronetUK site. One shows the double red lenses.. like mine and the other the triple cluster with the chrome surround you mention... and those weird triangle reflectors on the wings. All very interesting of course. You're all so passionate! I love it.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails DS Lucas tail lights-dsslar1.jpg   DS Lucas tail lights-idslar.jpg  

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