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  1. #1
    1000+ Posts dino's Avatar
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    Default Vevvvyyyy Interestinggggg

    http://cars2.ebay.com.au/J-S-HUNTER-...mZ200580612832

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    dino

  2. #2
    1000+ Posts robmac's Avatar
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    At least the body won't rust...

    I can't see how L15 running gear would fit 'tho.

    You would have to be very keen to try a restoration.

  3. #3
    VIP Sponsor David Cavanagh's Avatar
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    I'm just wondering where they got a L15 chassis from?
    David Cavanagh

    FRENCH CONNECTION / PEUGEO WRECKING / RENOSPARES / CITROWRECK

    03 9338 8191 or 03 93354008

    34 KING St
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  4. #4
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Cavanagh View Post
    I'm just wondering where they got a L15 chassis from?
    I was wondering who would pickup on that one I assumed they meant "Light 15 running gear".

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    'Cit' homepage:
    Citroen Workshop
    Proper cars--
    '85 Series II CX2500 GTi Turbo I
    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/citro%EBn-forum/90325-best-project-car-you-have-ever-seen.html
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


    Modern Junk:
    '07 Poogoe 407 HDi 6spd manual

  5. #5
    VIP Sponsor David Cavanagh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleChevron View Post
    I was wondering who would pickup on that one I assumed they meant "Light 15 running gear".

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    Floor pan maybe?
    David Cavanagh

    FRENCH CONNECTION / PEUGEO WRECKING / RENOSPARES / CITROWRECK

    03 9338 8191 or 03 93354008

    34 KING St
    AIRPORT WEST
    VIC 3042


    [email protected]

    https://www.facebook.com/FrenchConect

  6. #6
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Cavanagh View Post
    Floor pan maybe?
    Floorpan ... ?? that would be pretty bloody difficult to remove. It really is like a modern car ... strong sills, frail floors.... There's people here far more familiar with it than i'll ever be though The DS would be a lot easier as you could chop the hull down. The traction really is a monoque though.

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    'Cit' homepage:
    Citroen Workshop
    Proper cars--
    '85 Series II CX2500 GTi Turbo I
    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/showthread.php?t=90325
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


    Modern Junk:
    '07 Poogoe 407 HDi 6spd manual

  7. #7
    1000+ Posts gerrypro's Avatar
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    It is similar in construction to the Don Wright special, a well known monoposto racing car from the 1950s. Two tubular members running the length of the car to which is attached the rear axle support tube and a tubular frame work to carry the front suspension cradle. It can all be seen in the pictures, and hence he calls it a chassis.
    Cheers Gerry

  8. #8
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Gerry,

    Sorry, but the Citroen monoposto raced by Don Wright was nothing like the car featured in the for sale add. I will try to attach a photo of this car.

    J & S (Jeff Symmonds & John Jennens), last heard of as quality fibreglass boat builders, produced the fiberglass bodied Hunter 'kit car' that had a frame built by Jack Pryer (builder of the PRAD) to accept mostly basic Holden components. The suspension, brakes, steering (the rear being a Holden diff located by three modified Holden front suspension lower wishbones) were basically 'off the shelf' components. It was one of the better quality 'kit cars' available at the time.

    Note: Jennens dropped out from the firm fairly early in it's history.

    To fit a Traction mechanicals would have been bloody difficult, needing a complete change to the original structure. Look at the shape - even if you fitted a Traction drive assembly where would you put the radiator?

    Other kit car manufacturer's, such as JWF, sold a basic body shell that could be converted to almost anything, in my case a Ford Zephyr motored 'sports car' that is still doing the rounds of historic racing. Kinda dates one, unfortunately.

    Regards,

    fento

  9. #9
    1000+ Posts gerrypro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fento View Post
    Gerry,

    Sorry, but the Citroen monoposto raced by Don Wright was nothing like the car featured in the for sale add. I will try to attach a photo of this car.

    J & S (Jeff Symmonds & John Jennens), last heard of as quality fibreglass boat builders, produced the fiberglass bodied Hunter 'kit car' that had a frame built by Jack Pryer (builder of the PRAD) to accept mostly basic Holden components. The suspension, brakes, steering (the rear being a Holden diff located by three modified Holden front suspension lower wishbones) were basically 'off the shelf' components. It was one of the better quality 'kit cars' available at the time.

    Note: Jennens dropped out from the firm fairly early in it's history.

    To fit a Traction mechanicals would have been bloody difficult, needing a complete change to the original structure. Look at the shape - even if you fitted a Traction drive assembly where would you put the radiator?

    Other kit car manufacturer's, such as JWF, sold a basic body shell that could be converted to almost anything, in my case a Ford Zephyr motored 'sports car' that is still doing the rounds of historic racing. Kinda dates one, unfortunately.

    Regards,

    fento
    G'Day Fento
    I didn't say that it was exactly alike. Just that the principle of the chassis construction is similar. Obviously the two cars are worlds apart in style, but the fact remains that two tubular main members form the linking structure between the front and rear TA suspension units. That is definitely a Light 15 rear axle tube. It is modified at the central torsion bar mount, perhaps to utilise two triangulation rods. I can't see a front cradle in any of the pictures so it is possible that the front suspension is something else, however if you look inside the engine bay there are the two side mounts to accept the damper volute springs of a TA motor. It is also possible that a different radiator was used to lower the bonnet line. Remember that early D's effectively used the same engine and the forward bonnet line is very low.
    I have seen the Don Wright Special race at Winton and got a very good close look at how it was put together. Very Impressive! My friend Ken Gilbert interviewed Don for a CCOCA 'Front Drive' article many years ago.
    Cheers Gerry
    Last edited by gerrypro; 3rd March 2011 at 10:02 AM.

  10. #10
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Gerry,

    Gudday!

    I reckon your'e right about the rear axle mounting on the J&S Hunter, a closer look even seems to show the trailing arm attachment points. Whay a different beast it must have been!

    Will attempt again to attach the Wright Cit photo, taken at Oran Park sometime in 1965. The Cit was light bkue, and always immaculately presented.

    Regards,
    Fento
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Vevvvyyyy Interestinggggg-wright-citroen.jpg  

  11. #11
    Fellow Frogger! Trading Estate's Avatar
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    Great photo - you can see the Citroen mechanicals. love those 'Pilote' wheels!

    I just noticed in the J&S special that you can actually see the 'box' at the rear of the firewall where the rubber timing case rear engine mount would sit so the L15 engine is surely confirmed. The side mounts seem to be at different heights. Is that normal?
    Last edited by Trading Estate; 3rd March 2011 at 04:45 PM.
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  12. #12
    1000+ Posts gerrypro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fento View Post
    Gerry,

    Gudday!

    I reckon your'e right about the rear axle mounting on the J&S Hunter, a closer look even seems to show the trailing arm attachment points. Whay a different beast it must have been!

    Will attempt again to attach the Wright Cit photo, taken at Oran Park sometime in 1965. The Cit was light bkue, and always immaculately presented.

    Regards,
    Fento
    Yep That's her "all Wright"!! Pardon the pun!!!! Wonderful car and very impressive at full song.
    Cheers Gerry

  13. #13
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    Gerry,

    looked up me old photos (aaeeighoohh, curses, there must be cure for it) and found a few more of interest, including the Ian Hindmarsh Hunter. This was probably the best finished of the Hunters, and departed from standard by fitting wind-up windows.

    Taken at Huntley hillclimb (Wolongong) 3rd Nov 1963. Note another J&S Hunter alongside.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Vevvvyyyy Interestinggggg-car-maybe2.jpg  

  14. #14
    1000+ Posts gerrypro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fento View Post
    Gerry,

    looked up me old photos (aaeeighoohh, curses, there must be cure for it) and found a few more of interest, including the Ian Hindmarsh Hunter. This was probably the best finished of the Hunters, and departed from standard by fitting wind-up windows.

    Taken at Huntley hillclimb (Wolongong) 3rd Nov 1963. Note another J&S Hunter alongside.
    Yesterday I Googled J&S Hunter Special and Came up with
    http://www.bolwellcarclubnsw.com/page25.htm
    http://cars2.ebay.com.au/Holden-hist...mZ320616046702
    http://gallery.oldholden.com/Pigs-Ol...den+179+Coupe/
    http://wwwbollyblog.blogspot.com/201...-s-hunter.html
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J%26S
    Cheers Gerry

  15. #15
    Tadpole
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    Hi everyone

    Left replying to your [older] thread about this car till I finally got it home last week...


    I bought this after the ebay listing ended for what they actually wanted for it. By coincidence I knew the previous owner's father from the vintage car scene and they very graciously allowed me a fair bit of time to pick it up, hence my only just getting it home.

    It is truley an interesting car...I am into Australian Sportscars [only able to afford basket cases but you gotta start somewhere] and the Citroen setup makes irt even more interesting to me.

    To cut a long story short, I always like my cars to go back to how they were , but all the people in the know on these cars strongly suggest putting it to holden spec as they were intended,.and a simpler rebuild. Not sure if the Citroen stuff was put in post holden running gear or instead of in the original build?


    The story goes this car was registered and on the road presumably with the Citroen combo in it, surprisingly the builder in disgust took it back to the factory as the Front Wheel drive setup was atrocious [owners thoughts] and the car ended up on the factories roof as a display piece, and i am assuming the Citroen stuff disapeared before it went on the roof [weight reduction,cash in on the motor?...whatever]

    My intial thoughts were wow lets go Citroen..I love being different and if it was first built with this motor then thats what i like.

    But everyone is saying Holden...not only simpler but better resale.....but not as interesting perhaps. hee hee

    My question is how available are the Citroen parts I need , how cheap/expensive, and how much chance is it to get a running motor and clean ready to use suspension?

    I may start a separate thread on this subject after talking to you guys as the heading of this thread and the age of the thread may limit the amount of people answering my questions..but thanks to this thread i had found this contact [although surprisingly I have been on this site many times following links on french cars I was interested in.]

    it was so nice to google your thread knowing that some advice can be gleaned from those in the know on Citroens.

    looking forward to any help.

    cheers

  16. #16
    JBN
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    Did you run a panel beating business in Glebe by any chance. If you did, you would have resprayed my CX 2400 from bare metal to Glasurit Vert Papyrus in the mid 80's.

    John

  17. #17
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    hi john

    thanks for your reply

    Dont know how you got that out of my thread...but no, i am not a panel beater nor a mechanic just a collector..

    perhaps you gleaned that from the ebay listing, but I am the buyer of that car recently in last 6 months.

    Just a car nut with too many cars. or more so too many basket cases.

  18. #18
    JBN
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    Quote Originally Posted by J & S HUNTER View Post
    hi john

    thanks for your reply

    Dont know how you got that out of my thread...but no, i am not a panel beater nor a mechanic just a collector..

    perhaps you gleaned that from the ebay listing, but I am the buyer of that car recently in last 6 months.

    Just a car nut with too many cars. or more so too many basket cases.
    My car was resprayed by John Hunter in Glebe. He was a one time Citroen garage and has always driven Citroens himself. That's why I thought J & S Hunter may be the same, but it wasn't.

    John

  19. #19
    Tadpole
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    oh I see where you are coming from


    no the car is a J & S Hunter, thats just my forum name to associate me with this car

    J & S was the company...

    Hunter was the name of the car.

    I forget that J & S is often only known to the fibreglass car crowd.

    If you remember the beach buggies J & S were responsible for many of them...later went on to build hardtops for cars such as MGB when they realised that building cars was not profitable.

  20. #20
    Tadpole
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    in my opinion you should leave the car as is. I have had a Hunter since 1981 and I remember that car well sitting on the front awning of his factory. Jeff was doing work on my car at the time and I thought of buying it then because of its uniqueness. Did you buy from Newcastle by any chance? there where a few different variations of the car- one with Alfa Romeo running gear from new(still with original owner) jag 6 and v8 plus the Citroen one you have.
    I also have a Buchanan with Peugeot 403 front end (and the rest fj holden) that was a common upgrade on specials built around the 50/60's.
    if you want any info on J&S contact me. by the way all the moulds for the Hunter where thrown down the tip after Jeff sold the buisseness;he was not happy nor I as he had told the new owners I could have them. , (except for the bonnet mould that I have). from memory it was the Revsby tip and I actually went down there but was to late.

  21. #21
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    hi snico

    thanks for your interest...I was beginning to think no one cared if it stayed citroen

    No I bought the car from Sydney from the owner of the silver holden powered car.. I believe you know them as they mentioned a bonnet mold in WA..I [I wont mention their actual names on here for privacy] I have known the father for years from swap meets.

    By coincidence my car is missing a bonnet..fortunately it has the doors,...but would like to know what front and back windscreens they had

    I too have a Buchanan...infact a Cobra [rough]...one of the 7 or so made. A Goggo Dart {restored] and A Lightburn Zeta Sports [unrestored]...my little collection of Aussie sports cars..And I had to stop myself buying a local Buchanan a few weeks ago as I have too much stuff.

    Ironically I'd like to keep it as is but everyone saying go holden, and by coincidence my friend today just offered me a holden red motor with 5 speed that he bought off my next door neighbour before I knew about it.

    I havent recieved any responce here on the availabilty of said Citreon parts, but would like to put it back to original ...but it may not be cheap or easy to do that as the said chassis still is pretty rough.

    But...was the Citroen gear put in from new or did it replace holden setup..as an after conversion, hence not being original?

    I am into sportscars rather than race cars, so like something as it was made..rather than developed ...

    Not sure what to do as the chassis is rough enough and the local chassis builder [a friend from my Austin 7 days] is a mate of previous owners and said he can whip up a holden type chassis..

    your email is appreciated..

  22. #22
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    have send private message so hopefully gets to you as new to this site- I have had a number of pugs over the years ( sth african import 504&505gti, oz 504, 405 etc) so quite like this site.
    the rear screen is a special that you can make with access to oven or get someone to make it (as I did). you can use my old one as a mould- front is Austin A60.
    Hopefully the guys here can help you with the running gear as it would be very unique- yes was from new as that. coincidently the first car J & S made was a Moir Renault special- would love to get hold of one-about 19 where made. (len moir went on to design J&S hard tops,Hunter and beach buggies for Jeff)
    http://www.mgexperience.net/article/...-hardtops.html will give you some info on hard tops- and if you go to Beach buggy forums you will get info on his Beach buggies.
    hear from you soon
    ps- also have a MK4a and MK4b Bolwell- I am just as bad.....

  23. #23
    Fellow Frogger! Trading Estate's Avatar
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    If you go down the Traction avant route, others will have their ideas where to get the necessary mechanicals. A request in parts wanted on this site might do the job. You need an engine, gearbox (preferably the later ID 4 speed or an ERSA conversion which I have seen on quite a few open wheelers. Drive shafts, mounts maybe torsion bars etc. etc. Join the Citroen Classic Owners Club
    Website
    http://www.citroenclassic.org.au/
    There are a lot of spares tucked away all over Aus in garages. I remember when we disposed of a deceased estate full of bits years ago we were selling complete L!5 engines for $50.
    Maybe search for a rusty L15/ 11BL with all bits intact suitable for reco. Have seen a few in the last few years for under $1000
    Check Sydney enthusiasts (John Vanechop?),Continental motors contacts?, Cit car club NSW?
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  24. #24
    Tadpole
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    hopefull he will go down the cit route as that is how it was orig built. from memory the car had a bit of a space frame type chassis linking it together,with a bit of the ladder chassis under the car.
    i would have thought there would be enough parts and expertise to sort this car out.

  25. #25
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    Hi Snico and all

    am hoping to get chassis done next year, I have sold off some of my project cars to pay others to do the work, [much to my dismay as I indeed can weld and spray well, but damaged lungs stop me doing any of this, indeed stop me carrying parts around or pushing cars], so I am biting the bullet, ridding myself of lovely little micro cars [2 stroke smoke kills me] to restore my aussie sportscar basket cases.

    Still undecided about chassis and running gear, am still wanting to run the setup it had, but my chassis builder last time i talked to him seemed the holden route the best, and as he is mates with the silver car, and has reference to that it may be the safest option...but still I am torn. Infact its this thats holding me up starting.

    I also want to get my Buchanan Cobra chassis done too, but the Hunter is still on the trailer sans any running gear so has to be sent off first.

    Anyway i havent forgotten our contact Snico and will keep you updated as best i can.

    cheers guys.

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