BX 17 RD
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Thread: BX 17 RD

  1. #1
    Tadpole
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    BX 17 RD

    HI Cit Fan's!

    At first I'll send very nice wishes to you from the other side of the earth ;-)

    Last weekend my girlfrend said that she must driven for 4 good tires mountet on "some" old cars they wos waiting for disposal...
    And then I say, okay, fine, lets get the tires, but THEN i saw this lovely 2 Citroen BX (BX 17 RD und BX 19 TRZ)from 1985 and my heart began to knock for this "ugly" cars ;-)

    And it came as is should, now we have 2 "new" citroen's in our garage. The BX 19 is only a spender for the BX 17 while the don't have any papers more for it.

    The last week was very "hard" for my, since I've got this BX I'm "in love" to this car. *smile* ("normaly" I've a Daihatsu Sirion)

    The last owner told me that the BX 17 (that i want to repair) became hot in case of losing water.

    And now I am an the point that i changed the glow plug while he starts very hard, but if he startet he run's very good and he also re-start VERY good (only a little bit knocking from the valves but this is easy to correct and okay for that milage (179.000KMS))

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    A frend told me that the reason for this VERY bad starting procedere is a relay that let the glow plugs to short glow. If anyone know where these relay are locatet (if exist)

    thx

    Rainer

  2. #2
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    Rainer,

    Good to hear from someone over your way; may be warmer in Austria than Australia at present - your Summer = our Winter wink
    Regarding your problem, I would suggest that you may have picked the wrong country to ask this of as we were never lucky enough to have the diesels sold out here in the BX range, hence we do not have a lot of experience with them. However if the car was running hot, using water & hard to start I would say based on what I have read on UK boards, that you may have a blown head gasket.
    I have heard it said over there that the radiator should be tested & if showing below 60% flow rate then must be replaced to prevent a repitition of this.
    I would suggest posting a message on Andyspares forum as there are quite a few guys there who know PSA diesels inside out & either own or have owned BX diesels and should be able to help you sort it out.
    All the best & hope to hear from you again soon.

    Alan S

    <a href="http://www.andyspares.com/discussionforum/" target="_blank">http://www.andyspares.com/discussionforum/</a>
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  3. #3
    Tadpole
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    Alan,

    Thanks a lot for your informations, I did not know that in Australia are diesel engines are so "often" ;-)

    I would post the some on the andyspares forum.
    Our winter here in Austria are very colder than yours, or would you change? wink

    I don't think that I have really a blown head gasket, while I think then he would not so perectly re-start as it does if the engine is warm, but I let this not out of my eyes.

    Next week I hope I can tell you more about this when the BX is announced and when I can make the first "official" test drive on the road wink

    I have never heared that anyone (here)let his radiatior really test, but surely because of it that is our summers here many less hot than in your homeland. I think I will change the radiator from the BX 19 (it's the same) to the BX 17, but i will also ask for test the ("new")radiator.

    Which does disturb me really is that he don't have a temperature indication, only this lamp wos only glow up if he is already too hot...

    thx a lot again for you answer

    I will further inform you how's going on with my "baby"

  4. #4
    Tadpole
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    Impressions of winter in Austria

    After looking this, you would never say that now is winter in Australia wink

    The pic are from the Austrian 2CV club and with it's "Baby" on the pics.

    Have Fun with it

    <a href="http://oecc.nexenservices.com/Galery/winter.php" target="_blank">http://oecc.nexenservices.com/Galery/winter.php</a>

  5. #5
    Fellow Frogger!
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    I had a BX19RD in New Zealand, where diesels were imported. I drove a couple of turbo diesels, they are fantastic.
    As regards starting, it definitely sounds like faulty glow plugs. Even one faulty plug will cause hard starting. I would suggest first testing for voltage on the plugs when you turn on the pre heat, and if that is ok, then testing individual plugs for continuity.
    You also find in diesels you need a big battery to turn the motor over, it sounds like your battery is ok if it starts ok hot.
    I had the head gasket go in mine, it is easy to replace, a compression test would confirm that the gasket is OK, or if the radiator change works, that will confirm it too. Good luck, the BX diesel is a great car.

  6. #6
    Tadpole
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    The glow plug's wos the first i wos changed, 2nd wos the radiator. And the Batterie is very good for sure wink

    Yesterday I replaced the radiator, but the termostat (termical valve)does'nt open to water flow the rest of the system.
    And there are a lot of airpower inside the system, but I hope it isnt the heat gasket. (I hope that the air is from the rest of the cooling system that wos behind the termical valve)

    Today I go to replace the termostat (termic valve)
    Sorry for my poor english

    Sorry for my poor english.

    THX a lot

  7. #7
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    Rainer,

    Make sure that you get all the air bled out of the cooling system. On my 16V I have a bleed screw at the top of the radiator, two near the thermostat housing and one on the pipe for the heater at the back of the engine. As a clue, if you can make up a funnel from an old 1 litre oil container & seal it off around the filler cap and fill that with water (coolant) & let it just sit there whilst you squeeze hoses & open bleed screws, that sometimes will get the air that can get trapped in the system out. Ridding air out of the system of a Citroen can be a very frustrating job at times. A common problem is trying to fill the cooling system when the car is on an incline & as a result, sometimes the heater matrix can end up higher than the filler cap causing air to be trapped.
    Incidentally, don't apologise for your English; we can understand you better than you'd ever understand our Austrian dance

    All the best with it matey,

    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  8. #8
    Tadpole
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    Hi Alan!

    I tried to get the air out of the system with open the screw on the thermostat, but even after starting the engine for a few seconds (and without the thermostat) there are again a lot of air with high pressure in the system.

    If i tried to start with open system (on the radiator) the water springs out up to 1 meter..
    (in this case ONLY starting without running engine)

    And I recognice also that this is not the only air output... It also blow out air on the air cleaner box..

    So I think I have to change the cylinder gasket und straight the cylinder head, and/or see what's going on then.

    Here we have a nice proverb for things like this... "gives up does one to a letter" And i DON'T want to give it up

    Today I will remove the cylinder head an on monday i gave the head to straight.

    question
    Can anyone told me why you don't have diesel (Citroen's only??) in Australia? And how is this now? We here in Austria have now a rate from more than 60% of new car's with diesel.

    nice wishes and sleep well wink

    Rainer

  9. #9
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    Rainer,

    Have fun with the head off job and from what I hear, you are lucky that you don't have the turbo model. The normal diesel they tell me are quite simple (by Citroen standarsd but the Turbo can be a nightmare Look for cracks between valve seats also, as they tell me they can be a bit prone to that if they've been overheated.
    As to why we didn't get diesels out here I can only guess at it being one of several reasons; around the time of the BX being introduced, there was a change in Australian Distributors and the company concerned seemed to have been operated by a group who were involved with General Motors, hence they were non savvy as to how a dealership handling what is considered here a "unconventional" car really operated. Trying to sell cars to the opposite end of the market after being used to selling something that people just basically walked in off the street and bought was a challenge that they really didn't seem to handle all that well. My thoughts would have been to offer something entirely different and capture one small section of the market & expand on that but instead, they seemed to think that they could compete with the mainstream manufacturers on even terms. They didn't last long but it seemed long enough to do some irrepairable damage. peugeot sold quite a few diesels but again, prices were the dominating factor. At that time, diesel fuel was slightly cheaper than petrol but that gap has since disappeared. I also don't think that the rattly, smokey low powered Japanese diesels of the time did anything to improve the image of diesels in this country either mallet

    Have fun with the head gasket - don't let it drive you to a_drink too much

    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  10. #10
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    Hi Rainer,

    How does the price of Diesel compare to Petrol in Austria? I've heard that in most/all of Europe it is cheaper (as it should be here ) is this true?

    Cheers

    Stuey


    2003 PEUGEOT 206 GTi

  11. #11
    Fellow Frogger!
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    a big advantage of the diesel is economy, on my BX19rd, i got 35mpg around town, and up to 50mpg in the city. With diesel the same price as pertol here, it soon addsa up to a considerable saving

  12. #12
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Yeah,

    our CX wagon is the same. 2.2litre deisel (non turbo), it's um, 'sedate' but gets no less than 38MPG if it never leaves town and upto 42MPG on the highway...

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    'Cit' homepage:
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    '78 GS1220 pallas
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    Yay ... No Slugomatics


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  13. #13
    Member Dave B's Avatar
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    Stuey

    Diesel prices are roughly the same throughout Europe apart from the UK where it's getting on for about 30% more My Berlingo HDI does between 44-54mpg, so in France it is well cheap to run.
    The bloke with too many BX's

  14. #14
    Tadpole
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    Stuey,

    Diesel is here in Austria about 10% cheaper than "normal" fuel. But it is'nt the thing where the most costomers want. THEY wan't medium size car's like VW Passat they get only 5 or 6 liters/100kilometers (diesel) just the 9 or 12 liters/ 100 kilometers with the same or less power.

    If you get the most buyed engine here, you get a Volkswagen Engine build in a VW, or Skoda or Seat and somthing else. And this is a Turbodiesel with 90 or 100 Horsepower.

    My cylinder head I've been removed at the weekend, and what I see... is a damaged head gasket between cylinder 1 to cylinder 2, and after straighting the head they are about 1,5mm less metall on the cylinder head as it has befor. (but it wos easy to remove the head)
    Next week I will assemble the complete engine.

    Hold on, and pictures are also comming from removing an straighting.

    Head's up wink

    Rainer

  15. #15
    Tadpole
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    And here are pictures from my de-assembley

    <a href="http://www.8ung.at/rainers/auto/Image108.jpg" target="_blank">My car</a>

    Here is the remove cylinder head with the gasket

    <a href="http://www.8ung.at/rainers/auto/Image55.jpg" target="_blank">cylinder head with gasket</a>

    And here you can see a (the same!) straighted cylinder head.

    <a href="http://www.8ung.at/rainers/auto/Image58.jpg" target="_blank">straighted head</a>

    And the last one from inside car (no picture modification) YES the steer is on the left side wink

    <a href="http://www.8ung.at/rainers/auto/Image111.jpg" target="_blank">inside</a>

    Have fun

    Rainer

  16. #16
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    "YES the steer is on the left side"

    You saved me asking what the "driver" is supposed to do if the "passenger" has the steering wheel. a_drink a_drink a_drink
    Looks a nice car and it should go well after this job.
    That motor has the stretch bolts to the head that must be replaced also doesn't it?

    Alan S clown
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  17. #17
    Fellow Frogger!
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    when you reassemble the motor, it would be agood idea to change the cam belt too. These should be done every 100,000k from memory. If the belt breaks when the engine is running all your hard work will be ruined.
    Also, when you have the motor together, turn the motor over by hand for at least one complete turn before you try the starter, just in case the timing is wrong and you bend a valve. Good Luck

  18. #18
    Tadpole
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    Alan,

    Yes you have right. The straiht bolts SHOULD be changed, but, you can change all in an old car. The cylinderhead wos bent over the complete lenght for 1,5mm. And this is "normally" to much to straight. And for that reason I have to say "let's look what is coming in future" And the head is screwed hard (as it should at first with 30newtonmeter then 70 newton and finishing tightened with 120 degress). So I thing to change the bolts is not really necessary.

    The cam belt I will change too.

    Please let me say one for peoples they wan't to change this belt. it is quit simple. you have on every gear wheel a hole in the wheel an a thread on the engines side. Therefor you only need 3 8mm screw (2 with 60mm lengh and 1 with about 100mm) to fix the complete "settings" (valve's, injection and for the crankshaft) You NOT need to fix it at the point of de-assembling, you only need it when you build in the cam belt.
    (a great idea from the engineers)

    Thanks a lot for helping me

    Rainer

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