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Thread: Buying spheres?

  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! blomquvist's Avatar
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    Default Buying spheres?

    Hi Froggers,

    Am contemplating replacing the spheres in the XM. Any thoughts on the economics of sphere replacement welcome.

    Quote from gfs justed arrived - around AUD$76 per sphere, including postage (around 3-5 days from the UK).

    Pleiades will recondition spheres for around $37 per item, plus two lots of expensive postage from Melbourne to Qld, and having the car off the road for at least a week.

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    Interested in your thoughts on the relative merits of these or other sources.

    Regards,

    Greg
    1992 Citroen XM 2.0i Prestige 1989 Peugeot 205 GTI S2 (Little Red Car for sale) 1998 Volvo V70R AWD (Big Red Car)

  2. #2
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    I had spheres done by Pleiades a few years ago and they really do a good job, but; they will not recharge suspect ones and they give a warranty on their work, but; if a sphere goes flat within the warranty period or if you have a sphere that is irrepairable, you then have to source another sphere to have the job done and you pay the extra costs as regards freight.
    So, the decision you need to make is can you be without the car for a couple of weeks (minimum) but get it all done at half price or are you better going the new option which at $76 a sphere on the doorstep is really cheap, cheaper than anything you'll buy in Australia by a huge margin. Another alternative of course is to go with the new, get the others regassed in the future when it gets close to time to have them redone or get the originals redone and sell the new ones off for the price it costs from the UK which is still a good option for someone out here as hydractive spheres are all $120 for suspnsions and up to about $250 for anti sink (prices I've been quoted anyway) so anyone getting them a few weeks old for $76 each will be getting a good deal.
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger! blomquvist's Avatar
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    Thanks Alan - response much appreciated,

    You've summarised my own conclusions to the letter.

    One issue I'm not certain of is the anti-sink spheres. When I contacted GFS, I asked for a quote for all seven spheres required for a June 1992 XM. They responded with a quote for seven (possibly identical) spheres at GBP 18.65 (plus postage). Maybe I need to clarify that I need two anti-sink, one accumlator and four wheel spheres? Or are anti-sink spheres for later cars?

    So much to know, so little time...

    Regards,

    Greg
    1992 Citroen XM 2.0i Prestige 1989 Peugeot 205 GTI S2 (Little Red Car for sale) 1998 Volvo V70R AWD (Big Red Car)

  4. #4
    UFO
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    Quote Originally Posted by blomquvist
    Thanks Alan - response much appreciated,

    You've summarised my own conclusions to the letter.

    One issue I'm not certain of is the anti-sink spheres. When I contacted GFS, I asked for a quote for all seven spheres required for a June 1992 XM. They responded with a quote for seven (possibly identical) spheres at GBP 18.65 (plus postage). Maybe I need to clarify that I need two anti-sink, one accumlator and four wheel spheres? Or are anti-sink spheres for later cars?

    So much to know, so little time...

    Regards,

    Greg
    On a '92 XM you have three accumulator type spheres (ie no valving in the neck), two front and two rear spheres. I was tempted to get the comfort spec spheres but chickened out. I am still waiting on my two x front and rears to arrive as they are on a way in a friend's removalist container.

    Anti Sink came on the series 2 1/2 XM - in Aus with 24V V6 and AL4 electronic auto.

    Series 1 and 2 do not have anti sink. The centre accumulator sphere mountings for the suspension are a solenoid valve controlled device that opens and shuts according to the computer deciding whether you need hard (shut) or soft (open). The open gives extra damping to the suspension. (simplistic description but close enough).

    If you are a member of CCCV you may wish to contact them re getting spheres regassed.
    Craig K
    2009 C5 HDi Exclusive

  5. #5
    Fellow Frogger! blomquvist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UFO
    Anti Sink came on the series 2 1/2 XM - in Aus with 24V V6 and AL4 electronic auto.
    ....If you are a member of CCCV you may wish to contact them re getting spheres regassed.
    Thanks Craig. I'll clarify with GFS. I have recently worked out that my XM is a Series 1.5 (two-spoke steering wheel, series 2 door cards, hydractive II), not that it makes any difference.

    Have made contact with CCCV to join.

    Better get back to the wonderful world of work.

    Regards,

    Greg
    1992 Citroen XM 2.0i Prestige 1989 Peugeot 205 GTI S2 (Little Red Car for sale) 1998 Volvo V70R AWD (Big Red Car)

  6. #6
    Fellow Frogger! sdabel's Avatar
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    $76 is a bargain, you can check the types for your car using citroen pr net (based on VIN) or use the table on the GSF site.

    From my experiance replacing the centre spheres makes a big difference. On my car they were totally dead- no hope of a regass.

    regards
    sean
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    Just watch customs. Break up the order, any over $250 AUD they don't like. I received a bit of stick when I ordered 5 spheres for the cx. Having said that GSF are quick!

    regards
    Andrew

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    Fellow Frogger! blomquvist's Avatar
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    Thanks for the advice Andrew.
    1992 Citroen XM 2.0i Prestige 1989 Peugeot 205 GTI S2 (Little Red Car for sale) 1998 Volvo V70R AWD (Big Red Car)

  9. #9
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Sounds to cheap to me. Spheres were quite cheap from GSF, however that wanted over 60pounds postage to get them to me

    Plaides in Australia quoted me $170 for two front Xantia Hydractive spheres... yep, they have the sale !

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    'Cit' homepage:
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    Proper cars--
    '85 Series II CX2500 GTi Turbo I
    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/citro%EBn-forum/90325-best-project-car-you-have-ever-seen.html
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


    Modern Junk:
    '07 Poogoe 407 HDi 6spd manual

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    Fellow Frogger! blomquvist's Avatar
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    Just dropped in to The French Garage in Moorabin. Elliot has new "Spanish" spheres for $75. He'd just fitted some to a CX, and seemed impressed with them. Anybody know anymore about these? Maybe they're filled with olive oil.
    1992 Citroen XM 2.0i Prestige 1989 Peugeot 205 GTI S2 (Little Red Car for sale) 1998 Volvo V70R AWD (Big Red Car)

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    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    They've changed the URL of their website, but they were supposedly a very good sphere.
    I asked the question on a Cit board years ago when I stumbled across them and had a couple of responses from Spain and Portugal from Cit owners who gave them a try and reckoned they were as good as anything on the market.
    Here is the original link which shows their name, but I'd suggest giving Google a go and see what comes up.
    If you find their latest site can you post the URL here please and I'll ad it to my links.

    Website from Lizarte, a company manufacturing spheres & other vehicle components. They claim a 1 in 1000 failure rate with their products. Some interesting technical info on the site.

    http://www.lizarte.com/textose/aspectos8.html
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  12. #12
    Fellow Frogger! blomquvist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan S
    They've changed the URL of their website, but they were supposedly a very good sphere....<snip>...If you find their latest site can you post the URL here please and I'll ad it to my links.

    Here's the new link:

    http://www.lizarte.com/eng/index.asp
    1992 Citroen XM 2.0i Prestige 1989 Peugeot 205 GTI S2 (Little Red Car for sale) 1998 Volvo V70R AWD (Big Red Car)

  13. #13
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    That's getting a bit more like a sensible price for spheres. It makes buying locally a better option than running the gauntlett with Customs and tax departments or risk having freight dramas.
    GSF over there are about 20 UK pounds + 17.5% for locals. So you're looking at about = to $52..... or as a foreign buyer, it's $48 + freight say $20 + import duty of 15% (?) app $9.20 = $77.20 + GST.....Total almost $85

    Elliot's got me.


    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  14. #14
    Fellow Frogger! blomquvist's Avatar
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    On first impressions, Elliot seems to run a good operation. I'm going to have him check the spheres and replace with the Lizarte olives where necessary on 1 December.

    Also asking him to replace the XM's corroded strut top with the Nylander kit, which I was planning to attempt myself, then remembered that I'm better off doing what I do well (which doesn't include mucking about with mechanicals - a little embarrassing as much of my current work is in complex engineering environments).
    1992 Citroen XM 2.0i Prestige 1989 Peugeot 205 GTI S2 (Little Red Car for sale) 1998 Volvo V70R AWD (Big Red Car)

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    Fellow Frogger! ajpolden's Avatar
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    Do you have contact details for The French Garage? I may wish to try some of these spanish things - that's a pretty good price for new spheres!
    Thanks, Andrew.
    Current:
    1999 406SV (D8)
    Previous:
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  16. #16
    UFO
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajpolden
    Do you have contact details for The French Garage? I may wish to try some of these spanish things - that's a pretty good price for new spheres!
    Thanks, Andrew.
    Try

    The French Garage
    112 Keys Road Moorabbin
    9555 4248 (ask for Elliot)

    Quick quezzie - would these Spanish spheres be for, wait for it..............












    "OlŤ pneumatic" suspension?
    Craig K
    2009 C5 HDi Exclusive

  17. #17
    Fellow Frogger! doggiedog's Avatar
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    Just as a matter of interest, I just priced a replacement brake accumulator "sphere" for a Jaguar xj40 from a Jaguar specialist, who I know has competitive prices, and guess what, $250, and they don't regas them.

    I thought about trying to fit a Citroen one on, as it runs LHM, but havent got the time, and I bet the connections are different, and I thought Citroens were bad for access to spheres, this thing is diobolical.
    Terry


    1980 CX C-Matic Bleu Regate

  18. #18
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    With the Jag I understand them replacing the accumulator (isn't it refered to as the "brake bomb"). The reason being owners forget about them until they die filling the brake circuit with nitrogen UNLIKE citroens which will then just have a big time delay in braking due to air in the lines, the Jag will probably have NO BRAKES (unless you can pump the brakes really, really, really impossibly fast).

    Usually with CX brake accumulators it's a good idea to replace them when old too. Not only do you risk filling the brakes with air, more importantly it's a sh!t to get to and change a second time

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    'Cit' homepage:
    Citroen Workshop
    Proper cars--
    '85 Series II CX2500 GTi Turbo I
    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/showthread.php?t=90325
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


    Modern Junk:
    '07 Poogoe 407 HDi 6spd manual

  19. #19
    UFO
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    We did the front spheres on a Xantia Activa CT at the tech day last Sunday. There are FIVE of the mongrels to get off and then back on. Of course the strut ones are easy, the main and front "centre" (in reality next to the main accum) accumlators are easy too. However the brake accum is a shite (though not as bad as a CX).

    The front brake has a brake pipe feed arrangement and is mounted vertically with the brake pipe connection on top, under the battery. The owner laid on the ground under the car with the front up on ramps, I reached in with my Citroen arms and held the 9mm spanner while he turned the sphere. All went well until the last turn and the residual pressure and LHM in the sphere sort of went PPPPHHHHHHHHTTTTT - lovely! La Douche Verte!! Of course that sphere was a fair bit flat.

    It regassed OK but was a bugger to refit. I ended up taking the aircleaner AND mount out to be able to reach in enough to access the top of the mounting point for the sphere. To make things more fun, the seal had pushed up past the olive (prolly cause of the PPPHHHT) and was wedged on the bottom of the nut.

    About 45mins of farnarkling was required to restore sanity.
    Craig K
    2009 C5 HDi Exclusive

  20. #20
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    It's usually the dead ones that squirt I thought we hadn't released the pressure in the hydractive circuit of Rogers XM .... It gave him a nice shower as he pulled it off... We then realised it as the dead sphere squirting all over him (like I said before, it's always good when this stuff happens to someone else for a change ).

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    'Cit' homepage:
    Citroen Workshop
    Proper cars--
    '85 Series II CX2500 GTi Turbo I
    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/showthread.php?t=90325
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


    Modern Junk:
    '07 Poogoe 407 HDi 6spd manual

  21. #21
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    I take it Mr UFO and friends are aware that you depressurise a hydractive system on a Xantia by having everything set at lowest, doors open and the engine running?
    and even then they can squirtcha!!!


    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  22. #22
    UFO
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan S
    I take it Mr UFO and friends are aware that you depressurise a hydractive system on a Xantia by having everything set at lowest, doors open and the engine running?
    and even then they can squirtcha!!!


    Alan S
    Well yes, we did depressurise the system properly by the settings at lowest with doors CLOSED and engine running. An Activa will not drop its arse with the doors open - even when you open the bleed valve. All other spheres release with no hassle. Only the near dead brake accum went off.
    Craig K
    2009 C5 HDi Exclusive

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