my BX is STILL leaking!!
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  1. #1
    Tadpole Mench's Avatar
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    Default my BX is STILL leaking!!

    well I dropped the roof lining on sunday because I'd decided it was the front drains that were the problem. I found an ant colony in each of them, so, after a light mortein-ing, some careful cleaning and reattachment of the tubes, we stuck the roof back in and I thought my problems were solved.

    wrong. It just pissed down with rain and both front seats got a shower.

    I'm pretty sure its coming in from those drainage channels that run down the sides of the roof (on the exterior). That doesn't appear to drain into the sunroof area. The other explanation is that I did a bad job of reattaching the pipes and they've fallen off.

    any ideas on how to seal those channels properly?

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    '86 BX19GTi 8V

  2. #2
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    These sunroofs don't work on being totally sealed but more on the ability of the drains to let the water out, so if it's still leaking, it is either a rear drain blocked (the most common ones to get blocked) or the actual glass isn't seating on its surround which was the business of slackening the frame, pushing it up & retightening I spoke about in the earler post.
    The rear drains have to be fully clear; you need to be 100% sure they are or you're gunna get wet. Think about it; water gets in the channels, the car is moving, forward, so the inertia is going to drive the water towards the rear of the sunroof. You accellerate, the water again is driven to the rear. You're driving along at normal pace, the wind running over the roof of the car will to a degree pass through the side of the glass and in these channels and so again, blows the water towards the rear of the sunroof.
    Drains clear; water runs out of drains. Drains not fully clear, water backs up and overflows the channels and the cars interior cops it.


    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  3. #3
    Tadpole Mench's Avatar
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    yep, I read your thread about sunroofs, I understand the concept, but I'm pretty sure I got those drains clear. I'm talking about the channels that run about 2 inches in from the edge of the roof (roof roof, not sun roof). Do these drain into the same channels that the sunroof does, because I think that's where the leak's coming through.
    '86 BX19GTi 8V

  4. #4
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    You're not referring to the strips that run either side of the turret between the sunroof and gutters by any chance?
    They have been known to leak but usually only in Europe where their cars are constantly exposed to the elements and they have to dig them out from a couple of metres of snow to go to work of a morning.
    Have you blown up the drains when you've had the sunroof open and the tail lights out? Also, have you tried the frame adjustment yet, as I do feel that if your drains are definitely clear, that's the most obvious source of the problem as it allows water to get bwtween the glass and the frame and run into the cavity above the doors and from there usually into the passengers lap.


    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  5. #5
    Tadpole Mench's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan S
    You're not referring to the strips that run either side of the turret between the sunroof and gutters by any chance?
    They have been known to leak but usually only in Europe where their cars are constantly exposed to the elements and they have to dig them out from a couple of metres of snow to go to work of a morning.
    Have you blown up the drains when you've had the sunroof open and the tail lights out? Also, have you tried the frame adjustment yet, as I do feel that if your drains are definitely clear, that's the most obvious source of the problem as it allows water to get bwtween the glass and the frame and run into the cavity above the doors and from there usually into the passengers lap.


    Alan S
    I mean the channel/join that runs along the edge of the car, right above the door. There's a strip which appears to be plastic, and where that meets the roof itself there's a channel that runs along the length of the roof. This is on the actual panelling on the exterior.

    But I think you're probably on the right track with the frame adjustment, although I don't follow you entirely. Because this car's clearly been leaking for a while, the surround for the sunroof (the bit that comes out with it if you take it out) is quite rusty, and also the plastic guide arms have broken on the passenger side. I don't quite know what you mean by 'between the glass and the frame' though - which frame, and how does that run into the cavity above the doors (because that's almost definitely where the water's coming from)

    the sunroof mechanism doesn't work anymore, because the cables that move it are rusted. I did already blow up the pipes from the tail lights, but I'll do it again if I have to take the roof out again anyway.

    thanks heaps for your time alan, this forum's been a godsend
    '86 BX19GTi 8V

  6. #6
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    If she's rusty, chances are we might be fighting an uphill battle particularly if there's any holes actually rusted in it.
    By the frame and glass lid adjustment, I am talking about slackening those small torx head screws that face into the car when the sunroof internal screen is slid back. If they're rusted, then the next problem will be trying to loosen them.
    When the roof is closed, see if there's any downward movement if you press down on the actual glass.
    It may be worth contacting Martin Bray in Clarendon South Aust. to see if perhaps he can help out with a second hand sunroof frame. There was a good looking low mileage water damaged car sold through Pickles in Melbourne recently and as Martin seems to have his finger on the pulse of Cits at Auction, there is a chance he may have got it. Failing that, he could have wrecked some TRis which have the exact same sunroof.


    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  7. #7
    Tadpole Mench's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan S
    If she's rusty, chances are we might be fighting an uphill battle particularly if there's any holes actually rusted in it.
    By the frame and glass lid adjustment, I am talking about slackening those small torx head screws that face into the car when the sunroof internal screen is slid back. If they're rusted, then the next problem will be trying to loosen them.
    When the roof is closed, see if there's any downward movement if you press down on the actual glass.
    It may be worth contacting Martin Bray in Clarendon South Aust. to see if perhaps he can help out with a second hand sunroof frame. There was a good looking low mileage water damaged car sold through Pickles in Melbourne recently and as Martin seems to have his finger on the pulse of Cits at Auction, there is a chance he may have got it. Failing that, he could have wrecked some TRis which have the exact same sunroof.


    Alan S
    excellent, I may just do that, it'd be nice to have a working sunroof.

    there's a lot of downward (and upward) movement. the screws haven't rusted so much as what they're screwing into. No torx screws present, though, they've all been replaced with standard ones by the looks of things.
    '86 BX19GTi 8V

  8. #8
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    The reason I think you might be in luck is that I rang him last week and he seemed to have some....errr humm...unusal parts that would only be available if you had a 16V on hand (wink, wink,....nudge, nudge)


    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  9. #9
    Tadpole Mench's Avatar
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    have you got martin bray's contact? I assumed it would be in the Sticky, but alas...
    '86 BX19GTi 8V

  10. #10
    Fellow Frogger! Jack Z's Avatar
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    Mench,

    I had a rusty sunroof frame as well (the bit that holds the glass) and it repaired quite easily,,,

    Wire brush, silver solder and a good paint and you can't pick it.

    The chances of those chanels leaking are pretty slim as you'd defintely see the rust on the inside fo your roof when you dropped the lining.

    Alan is spot on.. every chanel needs to be totaly clean (it took me four goes to get it right if that helps!!) and whilat it may seem like they are ok you need to make sure they are clean and sealed water tight at all joins otherwise it will leak.

    Don't think that just because the water comes in from the front that that's where it's getting in... as most of it runs through th eback hoses so if they are blocked in any way it will back up.

    I also had water coming in from around the top corners of my windscreen.... how you might ask... ?? Some idiot decied to use silastic to seal the windscreen,, and it rusted the windscreen retianing chanel (the but behind the rubber strip) under (behind) the silastic so the water would find its way in through there and down the front pillars / roof lining onto the front occupants...

    Was a windscreen out job with a day of mig welding to fix it right... if its a structural leak (not a drain whole) I'm thinking there's more chance this is your culprit.

    Plan B.... Weld in a steel panel, fill and paint (both sides) fit a roof lining from a non sunroof car (TZI) and respray the roof...

  11. #11
    Moderator Alan S's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mench
    have you got martin bray's contact? I assumed it would be in the Sticky, but alas...
    From the "White Pages"

    Bray M & W
    19 Grants Gully Rd Clarendon 5157 (08) 8383 6207
    Mobile Service 0429 089 644


    BTW, straightest guy you're ever likely to deal with.


    Alan S
    If it ain't broke, use a 12" shifter.....that usually does the trick!!

  12. #12
    Tadpole Mench's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan S
    From the "White Pages"

    Bray M & W
    19 Grants Gully Rd Clarendon 5157 (08) 8383 6207
    Mobile Service 0429 089 644


    BTW, straightest guy you're ever likely to deal with.


    Alan S
    heh, thanks, I assumed he'd go under a trade name or something.
    '86 BX19GTi 8V

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