Citroen C4 2006 2.0i hesitation, weird rev behaviour, power drop
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Thread: Citroen C4 2006 2.0i hesitation, weird rev behaviour, power drop

  1. #1
    Tadpole
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    Default Citroen C4 2006 2.0i hesitation, weird rev behaviour, power drop

    Hi everyone.

    I bought a 2006 C4 2.0i ULP 4 speed auto 3 weeks ago with 69,000km on the odo and I'm having some strange issue with acceleration hesitation.

    The car has been back to the dealer once already to change the fuel pump. They have also done a full diagnostic with a Citroen specialist which returned no faults

    When I first got it for the first couple of weeks ago I would get a flat spot between 1500 and 2000 rpm between 1st and 2nd gear where the throttle became unresponsive for a couple of seconds, power drop to the point of almost stalling. Behaviour was intermittent and happened both with cold and hot engine

    Now for the past couple of days, the hesitation seems to have changed its behaviour noticeably... as if the ECU is trying to compensate for the issue. Now I seem to get a bigger/faster jump in rev between 1500 and 2500rpm in 1st before switching to 2nd gear (before that 2nd gear would switch from 1st gear around 2000 rpm) with somewhat of a clunky gear shift and occasionally i still get the unresponsive throttle at lower rev (especially going over speed bump) with the rev counter will go as low as 500 rpm.

    I'm taking the care back to the dealer on Tuesday. I've asked them to check the coil pack, maybe do ECU reflashing/updating and cleaning the MAF since it seems from my google and forum searching to be a possible cause for this issue.

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    The car starts perfect every-time, no fume from the exhaust, the engine block and all the pipes looks in great condition, the car itself looks also great and well taken care of with full services books done by a Citroen dealer. However it seems the car was not driven much for the past year before I got it.

    Do you guys have any clue what could be the potential cause of my issue? Is there anything I can do myself to try to isolate the source of the problem? Thank you

  2. #2
    Member geecee's Avatar
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    I can claim no expertise re Citroens, so this may be way off the mark. That said, until recently I had a remarkably similar problem with my 1985 Peugeot 505GTI. Cutting a long story short, the cause proved to be the air flow meter and a replacement (rebuilt) unit has it running perfectly again.
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  3. #3
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    Hi bsteve
    This is a guess really. Look at the throttle pedal unit. Check if the pedal travel gives a consistent increase in resistance with travel.
    The answer is to look at the diagnostics readings while driving it. Two person job and see what it says is happening when the hesitation happens.
    No codes showing means that the computer says it sees no problems. So it could be petrol related or the pedal input is seen as normal even if the driver thinks it is not !!
    Another outlier is water in the fuel. That can come and go but sometimes the car keeps going remarkably well. Remove the filter with a catch tray under it and then shake out the stuff in it and blow it through to see if there is stuff/water in it. The computer will not register any thing usually.
    Jaahn
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  4. #4
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    Default C4 issues

    Mate, like others here I'm not claiming to any inside knowledge on these car (although I have C5 myself) BUT having worked in the trade never dismiss the idea of the ecu being at fault - as I was tought "the last thing they will do is blame themselves". That said, I doubt you're at that point yet and the MAF seems like a probable culprit.

    Keep us posted please
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  5. #5
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    thanks so much for your suggestions guys. I'll keep you posted on the progress once I get an answer from the mechanic... I really hope it's something simple like the MAF... and not the ECU... but I'm certainly not ruling that out

  6. #6
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    Quick search revealed this if it applies

    https://www.audiforum.ca/a4-b7-typ-8...-solved-66075/
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  7. #7
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    Thanks driven. I haven't seen this fix before on any of the forums. Very useful, cheer mate, I'll make sure to pass that on to the mechanic.

  8. #8
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    From the Audi owner above -
    It turns out there is a flap in the air intake that is controlled by a motor that reacts to a calculation based on throttle position, rpms, load, etc. This motor was malfunctioning,
    The Cit throttle body valve is controlled by the computer depending on the position signal from the accelerator pedal sensor and engine requirements. For the most part Diagbox will read an error code if this malfunctions.
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  9. #9
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    yeah right so if this is happening they should be able to identify it with an error check while driving the car. The Audi owner also mentioned that he has an intermittent check engine code which I don't seem to have...

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    This is the diagram for the EW10J4 engine. As you can see, everything is driven by or transmits to the engine computer (1320). The pedal and the throttle body are controlling the combustion fuel supply
    Citroen C4 2006 2.0i hesitation, weird rev behaviour, power drop-ew10j4.jpg

    8007 pressostat
    7306 contacteur de sécurité du régulateur de vitesse (embrayage)
    7308 contacteur de sécurité du régulateur de vitesse (frein)
    1312 capteur pression air admission
    1211 pompe jauge carburant
    1120 capteur cliquetis
    1313 capteur régime moteur
    1620 capteur vitesse véhicule
    BM34 boîtier de servitude moteur 34 fusibles
    1320 calculateur moteur
    BSI1 boîtier de servitude intelligent (BSI)
    7215 écran multifonctions
    1135 bobine allumage
    1215 électrovanne de purge canister
    1332 injecteur cylindre n° 2
    1334 injecteur cylindre n° 4
    C001 connecteur diagnostic
    0004 combiné
    1316 capteur de position papillon
    1270 résistance réchauffage carburateur ou boîtier papillon
    1331 injecteur cylindre n° 1
    1333 injecteur cylindre n° 3
    1350 sonde à oxygène amont
    1351 sonde à oxygène aval
    1240 capteur température air admission
    7020 calculateur antiblocage de roue
    1220 capteur température eau moteur
    1261 capteur position pédale accélérateur
    1020 alternateur
    1253 électrovanne tout ou rien (EGR)
    4100 indicateur température + niveau huile moteur
    Last edited by seasink; 13th August 2018 at 01:19 PM.

  11. #11
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    There is software to fix this also needs an adaptive relearn from coolant temp below 30’ done correctly will fix it don’t throw any parts until this this done
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  12. #12
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    There is also a process that you run through a 'pack repair' in Diagbox that resets many of the sensor calibrations. You have to start with the car stone cold and then let it warm up until the fans cut in, then finish it by revving the engine to 4000 rpm.

    I know that following this process on one C4 sorted out a lot of unevenness in the drivetrain.

    Cheers, Ken
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by dmccurtayne View Post
    There is software to fix this also needs an adaptive relearn from coolant temp below 30’ done correctly will fix it don’t throw any parts until this this done
    Hey dmccurtyne, thanks for the info! Would you mind letting me know what the software fix is exactly, is it an ECU firmware update? Is this software fix available to auto electricians who are not a Citroen official dealer...? I want to be as specific as I can with the dealer I bought the car from. They are also a mechanical shop but when they fixed the fuel pump they sent it to a Citroen/Peugeot specialist here in Melbourne to get it done. Thank you for your help!
    Last edited by bsteeve; 13th August 2018 at 05:29 PM.

  14. #14
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    Yes get them to make sure the engine and auto software is the latest then do the reset should be fine but must be done cold so expect to leave overnight

  15. #15
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    well she is back at the garage now. Was a bit of a struggle to get there... stalled twice on a slight hill, and also got the service light that came on and the car got stuck in 3rd gear. Had to pull other, restart the car and the service light was gone... hopefully i get to the bottom of this soon. Will keep you updated with the progress. Thanks everyone for chipping in!

  16. #16
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    Are you running it on premium ULP?
    There is so much that could be wrong.
    I like your red herring that it hesitates worse over speed humps. I can't think of anything that would make it perform worse in this scenario.
    Does it have traction control? Can you turn it off and try driving?
    Sounds like it is running rich.
    Possibly the MAF sensor or one of the O2 sensors may be need replacing.
    Catalytic converter might be partially blocked due to incorrect fuel use by the previous owner.
    Usually they go into limp mode if the emissions have been breached or something catastrophic has occurred.
    As always start with the cheapest fix, new air filter, new fuel filter (if it is outside the fuel tank), new spark plugs.
    Other than that test fuel pressure at the rail.

    Regards,
    Curtis

    Sent from my SM-G920I using Tapatalk
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  17. #17
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    Re. the speed bump issue - I wonder if you may have a electrical problem - either a bad earth, or wire broken internally, or insulation worn through. The bump might be causing an intermittent break in connection, or short.

    Cheers

    Alec
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  18. #18
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    The 2.0L unit is the EW10, common to a range of Peugeots and Citroens.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by draftpunk View Post
    Are you running it on premium ULP?
    There is so much that could be wrong.
    I like your red herring that it hesitates worse over speed humps. I can't think of anything that would make it perform worse in this scenario.
    Does it have traction control? Can you turn it off and try driving?
    Sounds like it is running rich.
    Possibly the MAF sensor or one of the O2 sensors may be need replacing.
    Catalytic converter might be partially blocked due to incorrect fuel use by the previous owner.
    Usually they go into limp mode if the emissions have been breached or something catastrophic has occurred.
    As always start with the cheapest fix, new air filter, new fuel filter (if it is outside the fuel tank), new spark plugs.
    Other than that test fuel pressure at the rail.

    Regards,
    Curtis

    Sent from my SM-G920I using Tapatalk
    Yeah I've been using ULP 98 only.. but who knows what the previous owner has been running on. I haven't tried turning tracking control off.. but yeah the service light coming on a getting stuck in 3rd gear got me worried that this might not as simple of a fix as I previously thought.. all these issues leads me to believe it's an electrical fault in combination of a few other issues... It's with the mechanic now... so hopefully they can figure this out!

  20. #20
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    I had a problem with unreliable running in a different car, the problem was a small crack in a rubber pipe in the air inlet system, it mucked up the mixture at different throttle openings, similar problem with a small crack in my C5 diesel intake hose after the MAF, made it blow smoke when accelerating. Double check all hoses etc in the air system including the pipes to the vacuum power brake unit, push & pull them a bit as the crack may be nearly invisible unless deformed, a simple fix but sometimes hard to find.

    Regards

    agd123
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  21. #21
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    So I got the car back today. she is running much better. Still a bit of a flat spot going, by definitely much better.

    The mechanic said there was a fair amount of carbon build up in the engine due to the fact the car was used mostly for short trip at low rev it's whole life (12 year, 69,000km) at there is a possibility that the previous owner didn't use premium unleaded fuel .

    They decarbonised the engine, and fixed the transmission issue. I got advised that she still needs a good run on the highway @100km/h for at least 30/40min, and also give it a bit of a hard run pushing her into higher rev for extra cleaning.
    If the issue persist, they told me they will take the car back at no charge... They have checked the ECU, coil pack, spark plug etc... and everything looks fine. The carbon build up make sense to me.. hopefully it will get better from here!
    Last edited by bsteeve; Yesterday at 06:24 PM.
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