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Thread: Slough serial numbers

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    Fellow Frogger! Artificer's Avatar
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    Default Slough serial numbers

    New member & qualified, licensed NSW 'old school' mechanic.
    My Slough built 11 CL 8 Light 15 Citroen has a Chassis Number of 133266 Number on chassis plate RHF horn is a welded plate BPVS14328
    Planning to register in the next month or so on full registration.
    Was sold from another state as a 1953 but limited searching of the web seems to indicate it is a 1949 build.
    Any advice on a more accurate year model highly appreciated.
    Thanks JG.

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    Last edited by Artificer; 2nd May 2018 at 09:39 AM.

  2. #2
    Fellow Frogger!
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    According to this site Cats CitroŽn Net Traction Avant, Slough UK built your car was one of 18 built in 1949 at Slough.
    Cheers

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    Big boot or small boot? 1953 would have big boot, 49 small with spare wheel cover. It's easy to swap an ID plate, but not so easily the boot!

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    1000+ Posts gerrypro's Avatar
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    As David said it is easy to alter ID numbers---- even the welded BPVS plate. We can more accurately date the car by photos of the rear, the engine firewall the dash board, the interior trim. Using photos we can note the individual detail changes and determine the approximate build year. This will allow us to verify if your body identity plate is the correct one for the car.
    jaahn likes this.
    Cheers Gerry

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    Fellow Frogger! Artificer's Avatar
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    Thanks for the help.
    Slough serial numbers-chassis-numbers-3-.jpgSlough serial numbers-dscf1564.jpg
    Buckle Motors brass plate under the Aluminium chassis number plate has stamped 382688.
    Small boot, spare wheel cover & square Jaeger gauges L-R are clock, amp [Lucas], speedo, fuel.
    What was the original tyre diameter please?

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    For what it's worth, Buckle Motors Sydney sold cars with chassis numbers 133263 and 133267 in May and June of 1950, confirming the car's likely build at Slough in 1949. And the prices at the time were just under 1,000 Australian pounds.

    Those chassis-numbered cars were sold to individuals in country areas of NSW, including Dubbo. The absence of your car's chassis number in Buckle's sales list may suggest they wholesaled the car to another dealer, probably interstate.

    Good luck with your search.

    Ken

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    Fellow Frogger! Trading Estate's Avatar
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    Agree re 1949 , '50 reg in Australia. Does it have curvy deeper English style spring bumpers or did it crack the first of the more modern pressed bumpers?
    Wheel diameter 440mmm suitable for Michelin x

    edit I note that the serial numbers for all years "add up" except for 1949 . I doubt there were only 18 slough vehicles produced for cars listed with serial numbers 131523 - 133374. More like 1851!

    1949 was a prolific year for exports from GB in order to address their war debt. Many L15's came to Australia, New Zealand, South Africa etc


    Last edited by Trading Estate; 3rd May 2018 at 01:03 PM.
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    1000+ Posts gerrypro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kenlin View Post
    For what it's worth, Buckle Motors Sydney sold cars with chassis numbers 133263 and 133267 in May and June of 1950, confirming the car's likely build at Slough in 1949. And the prices at the time were just under 1,000 Australian pounds.

    Those chassis-numbered cars were sold to individuals in country areas of NSW, including Dubbo. The absence of your car's chassis number in Buckle's sales list may suggest they wholesaled the car to another dealer, probably interstate.

    Good luck with your search.

    Ken
    Could have been sold by Shields Motors in Victoria. They were the Australian concessionaires until taken over by Commonwealth Motors in 1953.
    Cheers Gerry

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    1000+ Posts gerrypro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Artificer View Post
    Thanks for the help.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Buckle Motors brass plate under the Aluminium chassis number plate has stamped 382688.
    Small boot, spare wheel cover & square Jaeger gauges L-R are clock, amp [Lucas], speedo, fuel.
    What was the original tyre diameter please?
    165x400mm Michelin Pilote tyres followed by X Radial ply tyres in the middle of 1949. Citroen Traction Avant cars were the first in the world to run radial ply tyres.
    Is the lighting switch in combination with the ignition switch? Or is it combined with the horn on the steering column? Is the wiper motor on the left or the right of the firewall panel? Are there one or two junction boxes for the wiring on the right hand firewall panel?
    Is the trafficator lever on the steering column or on the dash?
    Now do you get the need to distinguish subtle differences that occurred from year to year?
    With reference to your body plate pictures --- I am worried that the plates are riveted on. They were mostly fixed with round head screws. Maybe that is a Buckle Motors thing!
    Cheers Gerry

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    Fellow Frogger! Artificer's Avatar
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    It has nicely straight across curved spring steel type bumpers.
    They very old type pop rivets for the era when I was an apprentice.

    The turn signals are updated but there is a stalk out the the right just under the steering wheel & looks like a high low beam toggle on the end. The turn switch is on the stalk as well & small motor cycle flashers are fitted on stainless where the arm indicators used to be.
    Ignition is key & push button like many British cars of that era.
    This car originally came from outback country NSW I was told.
    Wiper motor is Lucas on the left & worm drive.

    I sold my W107 Mercedes 500SL when it was completed after 5 years work & then I needed another project
    Has quite few progressive mods & will never be totally original again, but I like good brakes on an everyday driver anyway.
    Will share pics when I get it back 'on the road again' as Willy said.

    One of the wife's friends indicated she saw a car nearly the same [Lt 15] & followed it to a residence in Elanora QLD yesterday.
    She gave me the address so I might go introduce myself over the next week.

    Thanks Guys

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    1000+ Posts gerrypro's Avatar
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    I wish you well with your project! So many parts are available today that were just not around 30 years ago that it is possible to make one of these cars drive and look just like new!
    Cheers Gerry

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    Hi JG,

    Welcome to Aussiefrogs. There are plenty of Traction nuts in the Citroen Car Club of Queensland, even the Membership Secretary Eric has several.

    Home

    AllenM who chimed in early in your thread has two Tractions and we had a fantastic rollup at Citin in Dalby over Easter - check the Club Facebook Page.

    Keep an eye open for the annual French Car Display on the 8th July at Murarrie Recreation Reserve in Brisbane.

    Cheers, Ken W

  13. #13
    Fellow Frogger! Trading Estate's Avatar
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    Your car sounds the same as the one I owned for many years

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Slough serial numbers-imgp5969.jpg   Slough serial numbers-imgp5977.jpg  
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    '71 16 TS, '72 16 TL, '74 15TS,'82 20TS Series 2, '85 25 GTX. '49 L15,

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    Fellow Frogger! Artificer's Avatar
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    Very similar although no sunroof.
    Thanks for the replies.

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    OK got all the rest on board. But what does the welded plate on the front drivers side horn that is absolutely original & unaltered, with stamped BPVS14328 actually represent, please guys? Can an exact year model be established from this?

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    The BPVS (Berline Petite Voiture Sport ) is the actual number for the coque (body shell) not sure how it relates to the chassis number plate on Slough cars.
    1950 Light 15 - Blanche 'Claude'
    1949 Light 15 - Noir 'Emilie'
    1982 2CV Special - Lagune Bleu 'Daffie'
    2007 C4 HDI EGS - Rouge Lucifer
    1968 Velo Solex 3800 - Noir

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    Quote Originally Posted by Artificer View Post
    OK got all the rest on board. But what does the welded plate on the front drivers side horn that is absolutely original & unaltered, with stamped BPVS14328 actually represent, please guys? Can an exact year model be established from this?
    Hi
    I am no expert here but did a similar search some years back. That number stamped on the horn plate was the production number for the 'coque', body shell, when it was produced at the factory in France. It did not necessarily proceed to be assembled straight away and if it is a Slough car it had to be shipped there and stored till it was assembled, then shipped to somewhere around the world to be sold. That sometimes took quite a few years perhaps.
    You should remember that materials were in short supply after the war for years over there and the government controlled supply and gave preference to cars for export, to earn money for the country. So things did not go smoothly on the assembly line.
    Jaahn

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    Hi,

    I joined the forum having read the post about your car and thought you may be interested in the story of my Light 15 which is now based in the UK. It too was a Slough build (chassis 133292) in 1949 although I agree with an earlier reply that it was from a batch of 1,852 cars and not 18.

    It was exported to Australia and has a Buckle Motors plate under the chassis plate, both held on with small black round headed screws:

    Slough serial numbers-buckle.jpg

    This plate number is 382682 (so 6 before yours) and yet your car has an earlier chassis number!

    I've owned the car since 2011 and from the information that came with it, was originally purchased by Mr Sidney Robert Phillips who lived at 33 Fourth Street, Weston, NSW. From a bit of research, Mr Phillips was a car mechanic and lived at this address from 1930 until at least 1980. The car was originally green in colour and imported back to the UK around 1960 at which time it was re-sprayed black and the engine re-built.

    Does anyone know what date it was sold to Mr Roberts e.g. do Buckle Motors have such records? Judging by Ken's (kenlin) post, presumably after June 1950.

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    I found your car in the Buckle Motors records Jon. Chassis number is 133292, Engine number shown as AL 06816, "Classification Number" 382/682. Perhaps someone else can explain the significance of that number. And the colour is shown as being Green.

    Car was sold on 5th April 1950 to a Mrs H C Maude of Double Bay, one of Sydney's eastern suburbs. Perhaps Mrs Maude was a relative or had some other connection with your Mr Phillips.

    Hope this helps while providing another mystery!

    Ken

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    Hi Jon,
    I believe I might shed some light on your car. In the '60s I was young and silly and owned a Traction B15 and got to know a couple of mechanics who had worked on Citroens at the dealer in Newcastle Au. They were actually apprentices there some years before.

    Sid Phillips was one of them and helped me a bit a couple of times. He lived in Weston, and then was working for BMC, but drove a good looking green LT15 with an ID motor which he had done up and the car was fully restored and in 110% condition. I was driven in it a couple of times. Quite quickly too. Sid would not have bought that car new but he worked in the car trade so he probably picked out a good one to buy for his own.

    Some time later, perhaps around 1970, Sid went to the UK and took his car with him, as it was his love He was over there for some years and he sold it before he returned to Australia. I met him again and he was working at a Sydney Citroen dealer in the "80s some time. He eventually returned back to his family home in Weston and gave up mechanics and had a shop. He had tired of cars by then he told me. Have not seen him for years now. He would be about 80+ now I guess. Always a gentleman too
    PM me for any more information.
    Jaahn

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    Fellow Frogger!
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    I was under the impression that the Buckle Motors records no longer existed. What a pleasant surprise to find that is not correct. I have two questions in relation to those records. Firstly do they show the original owner of this French built Legere, which I have owned for 39 years and am still restoring (can't rush these things) and is there a record of a sale in 1950/51 to James Maze of Dorrigo of a Slough built Light 15 which was registered FF432. I would get a great deal of satisfaction if those questions can be answered. Thanks. Allen.
    This is the plate from the Legere.
    Slough serial numbers-dscf4570-1-.jpg

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    Legere sold to A C Angus, Campbell Parade Bondi Beach. Reg number was XP-206; chassis 557100; engine number AB10975 and colour was m. grey.

    The James Maze car was sold on 16 Feb 1950; classification number 367-696; registration FF432; chassis 133194; engine number AN06730 and colour was black.

    Hope this helps.

    Ken

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    That is fantastic information, thank you so much for that Ken.

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    It would be nice if some one could turn up the sales records for Shields Motors and then Commonwealth Motors in Victoria.
    Kenfuego likes this.
    Cheers Gerry

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    Aluminium chassis number plate has stamped 382688
    Any info on the history of this Buckles plate please, Jon?
    BTW this car is re-registered in Queensland as 1949. AMI949 regn. number.

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