C5 suspension pump relay location
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Thread: C5 suspension pump relay location

  1. #1
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    Default C5 suspension pump relay location

    Hi
    Having a suspension pump issue where the maxi fuse has blown a couple of times and now is unable to lift off the deck. Doing the usual research plus contemplation of what is the actually the problem. There is power to the pump feed (when new maxi fuse is installed). Have removed the pump and it spins when power applied though can't really apply a load to fully test.
    I did notice on service citroen the schematic for the pump includes a relay- 6500VL - see below. This a pluggable unit and is an available part. But the question is where is it located?
    Cant see around the fuse boxes area or around where the pump sits. Interestingly while doing the research across the planet others have asked the same question with no one able to supply an answer (but offer that it may be the problem)?
    Forget to mention that this for my 2007 car as per signature.

    Thanks


    C5 suspension pump relay location-c5-6555vl.jpg

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  2. #2
    Fellow Frogger
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    If it has power and the fuse blows, try cleaning the brush box and stopping any LDS leaking onto it.
    Greg likes this.

  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger! Greg's Avatar
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    David hit the nail on the head........

    The brushes can build up carbon deposits and short out the motor and blow the fuse. There is no real waterproofing between the brush housing and the motor body. A wide rubber band or something similar to seal the brush housing should stop it happening a second time?

    Our old red wagon had it happen, and it wasn't the LDS leaking, but moisture from somewhere, maybe a carless filling of the coolant bottle?

    best regards,

    Greg
    We Have:
    C5 HDI Exclusive 2.7 '09, Pluriel '09, Berlingo 1.6 HDI '10, C4 VTS coupe. C4 Picasso '08, 2CV Charleston '84 Grey, 2CV, '55 Australian delivered. 15/6 H '55, SM '74 BVM, DS21 EFI BVH, DS21 '67 BVH.
    We Had:
    1930C6F, '73 GS1220 wagon X 2, '75 G special, '75 GS panel van, '74 GS Birotor, '82 GSA panel van with factory AC, '85 CX25GTI BVM, 2002 C5 V6, 2006, C5 S2 HDI, '86 BX19GT, '72 DS21 BVM, '55 15/6H, '54 Lt 15,'73 Dyane, '82 Visa Super X, with Chrono Mecs & factory AC, 1972 SM.

  4. #4
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    Motor pulled apart, one area of the commutator a little darkish but overall no obvious damage, grunge or fluid ingress, should clean up ok out of time today. Has anyone separated pump from motor as there s quite some resistance from the pump when turning the rotor by hand?C5 suspension pump relay location-commutator.jpgC5 suspension pump relay location-brushes.jpg
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  5. #5
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    It's such an interesting issue I find, I'm trying to fix the same pump myself. Technical section.

    Your motor internals were not dirty or oily..
    So you still do not know why it blew fuzes.

    A clamp tester can easily measure the amp draw,
    I have just done that test, the draw was just 20amps
    My issue is with the terminal block heating up, attached to the motor..

    Maybe your windings are suspect or the varnish is breaking down or a short in the motor.
    These I have had suggested to me as reasoning for my issue.

    All a bit of a mystery really, I note a replacement seems to fix things.
    I'm trying to locate the source of the problem, but that's just me.

    So I will be pleased to learn what you find out..
    Last edited by Biker; 12th February 2018 at 12:39 PM. Reason: clearer

  6. #6
    Fellow Frogger
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    You want to clan and lightly undercut those segments.
    Don't forget the pump is not meant to run all the time. Only long enough to raise the car and that's often just a few seconds when opening the door. If it runs a lot, there may be an internal leak.
    Biker likes this.

  7. #7
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    Maybe the relay is the 'unit' on the right hand side of the connection block that the two power lines plug into, on the elec motor.
    I say this because that little black 'unit' is what's getting hot as my motor overruns. Runs too long, that unit gets hot.
    And relays handle a lot of power in transmission or something like that.
    I see it unscrews, so maybe inside there are replaceable parts.
    Maybe the whole unit is a relay 6500VL

  8. #8
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    20 amps at 12 volts is 240 watts. That is 1/4 of a kilowatt! That seems quite a lot........
    JohnW

    Renault 4CV 1951
    Renault R8 1965
    Renault Scenic 2005 (wife's)
    Renault Scenic 2007 (mine)
    Peugeot 306 XT 1995 (daughter's)
    CitroŽn CX Pallas 1980

    National Co-ordinator, Renault 4CV Register of Australia

  9. #9
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    Yes I haven't finished the cleanup, basically just scratching out the gunk between the commentator bars then a polish with some emery type paper. Biker I did start to open the black unit but stopped at the black plugs sealing the power leads and did wonder whether it is the relay. As well as in your posts I tried to separate the pump from motor but baulked for the same reason, only moved a few mm and didn't feel quite right. I did note that pump and motor spins freely- is that by hand or when powered? Mine does not spin freely by hand. Anyway its going to be a week or two before I can back at this job but will be following your efforts.

    Sent from my LG-D802T using aussiefrogs mobile app
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnW View Post
    20 amps at 12 volts is 240 watts. That is 1/4 of a kilowatt! That seems quite a lot........
    Oh ok.. The fuze is 40amp so I had imagined the pump was drawing half of it's safe maximum.
    I would imagine it needs to draw a lot of power, to drive the pump..
    I 'think' my overheating connection box on the elec motor is from overrunning,
    so maybe it's designed function is to be quite powerful requiring lots of current, but not for too long..
    My initial fault was a blown maxi 40amp fuze.

  11. #11
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Biker View Post
    Oh ok.. The fuze is 40amp so I had imagined the pump was drawing half of it's safe maximum.
    I would imagine it needs to draw a lot of power, to drive the pump..
    I 'think' my overheating connection box on the elec motor is from overrunning,
    so maybe it's designed function is to be quite powerful requiring lots of current, but not for too long..
    My initial fault was a blown maxi 40amp fuze.
    Good luck with it. I agree with your logic, FWIW, but am out of my depth as the CX doesn't quite have these things. I wonder what current my Renault electric power steering draws, come to think of it!!

    Cheers
    JohnW

    Renault 4CV 1951
    Renault R8 1965
    Renault Scenic 2005 (wife's)
    Renault Scenic 2007 (mine)
    Peugeot 306 XT 1995 (daughter's)
    CitroŽn CX Pallas 1980

    National Co-ordinator, Renault 4CV Register of Australia

  12. #12
    Fellow Frogger! Greg's Avatar
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    Hi Guys,

    My work with the electric hyd pumps is only the one experience as previously stated above. They generally give very little problem.

    Yes the pump does draw a lot of power, but it should also be able to run for a some extended period, as when the spheres have been changed, and the unit has to bleed itself.

    A word of warning here: If you are doing any work on the hydraulics, especially if the car is on stands, either loosen or remove the tank cap.

    Failure to do so, while lowering the car back onto the ground can result in either a blown hose where the tank connects to the power steering pump, or a cracked hydraulic tank. I loosen the cap when ever doing anything with the hydraulics.

    Have you guys cleaned up the brush assembly and but everything back together, and tried the pump?

    best regards,

    Greg
    We Have:
    C5 HDI Exclusive 2.7 '09, Pluriel '09, Berlingo 1.6 HDI '10, C4 VTS coupe. C4 Picasso '08, 2CV Charleston '84 Grey, 2CV, '55 Australian delivered. 15/6 H '55, SM '74 BVM, DS21 EFI BVH, DS21 '67 BVH.
    We Had:
    1930C6F, '73 GS1220 wagon X 2, '75 G special, '75 GS panel van, '74 GS Birotor, '82 GSA panel van with factory AC, '85 CX25GTI BVM, 2002 C5 V6, 2006, C5 S2 HDI, '86 BX19GT, '72 DS21 BVM, '55 15/6H, '54 Lt 15,'73 Dyane, '82 Visa Super X, with Chrono Mecs & factory AC, 1972 SM.

  13. #13
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    Not to jump Davids thread.. But yes the pump should run for longer than mine does without getting hot..
    both my other C5 2004 / 2010 low to hi and back again, no heat at all..
    I was trying to locate the source of the 'heat build-up' yes I found it to be at the black module on the power connection box attached to the elec motor..

    But that tact has not fixed it..
    Am replacing my unit to see what happens.
    At that time I will disassemble the module and connection box for a real good look.
    Greg's warnings are appreciated, am new to Citroen and loving it.

    Yes 'my' brushes and commy are clean and looking good..

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