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    Fellow Frogger! k eeles's Avatar
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    Default D Special - blue seat covers

    Greetings all.

    I'm still missing my D Spec that I sold to Syd last May; but he regularly sends me photos of 'the old girl' in picturesque Melbourne settings. It eases 'the longing' to see him enjoying her so.

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    Sometime ago (I can't recall when) there was some discussion on AF about Blue seat covers on D Specials - mostly white ones - that had blue seat covers as original; despite what Reynolds' book states.

    Some denied they ever existed but there were at least three other cars, with blue covers as original, that came to light. I am 100% certain my old car's covers were original

    Help please. Can anyone recall or find those posts?

    The chassis of my old car was 08 FD1569.

    Cheers. Kevin
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    Hi Kevin, my D Special came with blue interior. 74 model, I flicked them to Denton at European Autocare who graciously let me swap for some decent red ones. The blue ones were ruined. They didn't have the white vinyl backing on the front seats though, had the basic centre stitch ribbing on back and seat. Ken in Blue Mountains confirmed DSpecials at the time had blue seats on white paint jobs, I think his brother backed him up on this too from our conversation. I also saw one in Paddington years ago and a 23 on the net, so the factory info, and sites like Nuanciers site etc is not entirely correct. I imagine John in Armidale ( but I meant care of edit here Greg in Maitland, apologies..) would concur as he worked on them back then? Pretty sure I had a blurb on my DSpecial renewal thread in restoration section.
    Last edited by forumnoreason; 1st November 2017 at 09:35 PM.
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    Fellow Frogger! k eeles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by forumnoreason View Post
    Hi Kevin, my D Special came with blue interior. 74 model, I flicked them to Denton at European Autocare who graciously let me swap for some decent red ones. The blue ones were ruined. They didn't have the white vinyl backing on the front seats though, had the basic centre stitch ribbing on back and seat. Ken in Blue Mountains confirmed DSpecials at the time had blue seats on white paint jobs, I think his brother backed him up on this too from our conversation. I also saw one in Paddington years ago and a 23 on the net, so the factory info, and sites like Nuanciers site etc is not entirely correct. I imagine John in Armidale would concur as he worked on them back then? Pretty sure I had a blurb on my DSpecial renewal thread in restoration section.
    Thank you for your prompt reply. I do recall your restoration ans I sincerely hope you are 'almost' finished and enjoying labour of love.

    Lance (DS Motors) has never made any comment about the seats being 'non original'......and he'd let me know!

    Ken from Blue Mountains called to see me during his trip to the north this year. We had a drive of my D Special and he did not make any comment either. But he is a very a polite and courtesy gentleman.

    cheers Kevin
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    Thank God I'm a Frenchman harrisson_citroen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by k eeles View Post
    Thank you for your prompt reply. I do recall your restoration ans I sincerely hope you are 'almost' finished and enjoying labour of love.

    Lance (DS Motors) has never made any comment about the seats being 'non original'......and he'd let me know!

    Ken from Blue Mountains called to see me during his trip to the north this year. We had a drive of my D Special and he did not make any comment either. But he is a very a polite and courtesy gentleman.

    cheers Kevin
    Do you remember what year model Kevin?
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    Thank God I'm a Frenchman harrisson_citroen's Avatar
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    http://www.nuancierds.fr/interieurs/...uper5%2074.jpg

    In 1974 only the DSuper had blue seats apart from higher specs like DS Pallas , but no DSpecial apparently.
    DS Un jour, DS toujours !

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    Hi Kevin
    Nice to hear from you again, via AF. I thoroughly enjoyed our time together at Buderim in May and my "Cit-fix" with you after some months on the road in the Pajero and caravan.

    I manage to get access to sales records from former NSW Distributor Citco at Glebe, for the period they were selling Citroens. For 1974 D Specials sold from January to end of June 1974, I have counted 7 cars in their records, described as being white and with blue trim. Red was the other popular colour of course and there were one or two sold with grey, gold or green trim. The records I see don't have chassis numbers for those sales but there are engine numbers listed. If you still recall your D Special's engine number, I may be able to retrieve some more info.

    Hope this finds you both well and enjoying your beautiful part of Qld.

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    Thank God I'm a Frenchman harrisson_citroen's Avatar
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    D Special - blue seat covers-nuancier-id-et-break-74.jpg

    In this attached original sales brochure from 1974, the only DSpecial with blue seats would need to be either painted Bleu Lagune or Bleu Delta, the White Blanc Meije only came in either Black Targa, or Red Cornaline maybe the local dealer changed the seat covers but I doubt it considering they were the base models and the expense would have been quite large.

    "It's a pigment of your imagination"
    Last edited by harrisson_citroen; 30th October 2017 at 04:48 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by harrisson_citroen View Post
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	nuancier ID et break 74.jpg 
Views:	47 
Size:	56.6 KB 
ID:	101054

    In this attached original sales brochure from 1974, the only DSpecial with blue seats would need to be either painted Bleu Lagune or Bleu Delta, the White Blanc Meije only came in either Black Targa, or Red Cornaline maybe the local dealer changed the seat covers but I doubt it considering they were the base models and the expense would have been quite large.

    "It's a pigment of your imagination"
    Thanks for the screenshot of the brochure.

    Kevin is asking on my behalf and demonstrates his hospitable and gentlemanly spirit.

    What I do know is that the brochures themselves are not accurate for Australian delivered DSpecials. As discussed by ajaxvte, his original DSpecial has always had a black vinyl interior with AC084 (ivoire borely iirc). Yet according to le nuancier DS and the brochures, this combination does not exist.

    Regards Syd

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    1974 Citroen D Special (Blanc Meije)
    1989 Citroen 2CV 6 Dolly (Plum & Custard)
    1995 Citroen XM Series II V6 (Vert Vega)

    (Previously owned Frenchies - 1976 Citroen GS 1220, 1997 Peugeot 306 XSi)

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    Quote Originally Posted by kenlin View Post
    Hi Kevin
    Nice to hear from you again, via AF. I thoroughly enjoyed our time together at Buderim in May and my "Cit-fix" with you after some months on the road in the Pajero and caravan.

    I manage to get access to sales records from former NSW Distributor Citco at Glebe, for the period they were selling Citroens. For 1974 D Specials sold from January to end of June 1974, I have counted 7 cars in their records, described as being white and with blue trim. Red was the other popular colour of course and there were one or two sold with grey, gold or green trim. The records I see don't have chassis numbers for those sales but there are engine numbers listed. If you still recall your D Special's engine number, I may be able to retrieve some more info.

    Hope this finds you both well and enjoying your beautiful part of Qld.
    Hi Kenlin,

    This is fantastic. Thank you so much for the information. I am likely going to check with the Conservatoire regarding Kevin's and my DSpecial.

    Regards Syd

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    1974 Citroen D Special (Blanc Meije)
    1989 Citroen 2CV 6 Dolly (Plum & Custard)
    1995 Citroen XM Series II V6 (Vert Vega)

    (Previously owned Frenchies - 1976 Citroen GS 1220, 1997 Peugeot 306 XSi)

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    I have a 1971 D special white with its original green interior. Again according to the nuancier website and Reynolds book this combination "shouldn't " exist. Wonder whether it has anything to do with the fact that particularly for the 1974 Australian cars they were D Special De Luxe not just plain D Specials ?
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    Harrison my DSpecial had blue interior white exterior and I'm not colourblind and whilst I considered the notion that yes it may have been swapped over the ageing of the interior was completely consistent so no pigment of the imagination!

    Just because a document exists doesn't mean some French blokes didn't shove some blue bits in 7white cars and send them to Australia. 8 in fact as Ken had no record of mine!
    Last edited by forumnoreason; 30th October 2017 at 07:52 PM.
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    From what I have been able to glean, the later the production (especially toward the end), the more the assembly plant was reaching into parts bins to cobble the cars together. I don't think I have seen two late Ds that are the same - they all seem to differ in at least a few details, including in interior colours and materials that depart from the "official" combinations.

    Quote Originally Posted by gsowner84 View Post
    Thanks for the screenshot of the brochure.

    Kevin is asking on my behalf and demonstrates his hospitable and gentlemanly spirit.

    What I do know is that the brochures themselves are not accurate for Australian delivered DSpecials. As discussed by ajaxvte, his original DSpecial has always had a black vinyl interior with AC084 (ivoire borely iirc). Yet according to le nuancier DS and the brochures, this combination does not exist.

    Regards Syd

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    Quote Originally Posted by forumnoreason View Post
    doesn't mean some French blokes didn't shove some blue bits in 7white cars and send them to Australia.
    Well, maybe, but for hum what reason? Why would 7 DS's be different than the rest ? Special orders? not likely on a base models.
    I tend to think they were customized.
    It is only recently that the DS has become a "classic", you may not remember that not so long ago they were seen as a piece of crap and on a long downward spiral, worth virtually nothing. Lots of them changed hands for 3 or 4000 bux.
    I myself have changed colours on Dees 4 times in the past 20 years, one of them twice. Of course I now regret it and am also looking for the original look.
    Another factor is that it was soooooo easy to change the interior of a Dspecial, the seats, door cards and carpet. I would do that in an afternoon. And everytime I would sale the original interior on Ebay, and then the buyer would change the colour of His car, and on it went. The Pallas is a little harder.

    So yes it is entirely feasible they are not original even though they show patina. I guess if the seven car owners can take pictures and show that they are the same shade of blue and same material, then I'll admit defeat.

    By the way, the DS23 shown in the avatar below used to be grey. Now it's blue and you could swear it's original.
    Last edited by harrisson_citroen; 30th October 2017 at 09:17 PM.
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    defeat? Ken has the original records of these details so time to move on!

    to be fair you should only request ONE as that is enough proof in itself.

    If you want to insult me please refer to me by my Christian name which is Steven. Bon nuit.
    Last edited by forumnoreason; 30th October 2017 at 09:23 PM.
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    Thank God I'm a Frenchman harrisson_citroen's Avatar
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    DS Un jour, DS toujours !

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    Quote Originally Posted by harrisson_citroen View Post
    Well, maybe, but for hum what reason? Why would 7 DS's be different than the rest ? Special orders? not likely on a base models.
    I tend to think they were customized.
    It is only recently that the DS has become a "classic", you may not remember that not so long ago they were seen as a piece of crap and on a long downward spiral, worth virtually nothing. Lots of them changed hands for 3 or 4000 bux.
    I myself have changed colours on Dees 4 times in the past 20 years, one of them twice. Of course I now regret it and am also looking for the original look.
    Another factor is that it was soooooo easy to change the interior of a Dspecial, the seats, door cards and carpet. I would do that in an afternoon. And everytime I would sale the original interior on Ebay, and then the buyer would change the colour of His car, and on it went. The Pallas is a little harder.

    So yes it is entirely feasible they are not original even though they show patina. I guess if the seven car owners can take pictures and show that they are the same shade of blue and same material, then I'll admit defeat.

    By the way, the DS23 shown in the avatar below used to be grey. Now it's blue and you could swear it's original.
    Hi Harrison,

    As ajaxvte alluded to, Australian delivered DSpecials were different. And in 74 and 75, I think it is not unusual for DSpecials to have different specs from the official literature. I heard that Australian D's were primarily shades of white due to the sun. Cannot verify this. But it is consistent with what Kenlin and forumnoreason have stated.

    I have made contact with the Conservatoire and am looking into getting the car's official birth certificate.

    Kind regards Syd

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    1989 Citroen 2CV 6 Dolly (Plum & Custard)
    1995 Citroen XM Series II V6 (Vert Vega)

    (Previously owned Frenchies - 1976 Citroen GS 1220, 1997 Peugeot 306 XSi)

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    Harrison_Citroen,
    I'm beginning to think you like to argue for the sake of it. Most of your posts are informative and conducive to discussion. But....when you 'hook into' an issue where an informative site/document is available.....!

    I was an auditor for 25 years before I retired. I learnt very quickly 'never accept information at face value. There are always exceptions. Some deliberate, some an oversight'

    Cheers and stay away from the storms down your neck of the woods.

    Kevin
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    Kevin my PLEB DSpecial (as some have referred to them as unfortunately) is FD 1633. So those French men and no doubt women clearly chose to ignore the factory specifications police to do as they pleased and furnish these vehicles with the wrong upholstery, (maybe even blue velour?) over a minimum range of 64 vehicles!
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    Hi Everyone

    The Reynolds book is about mainly UK & French delivered cars and specs.........

    Some of the things re trim specs, colour etc, get thrown out the doors when it comes to some export markets.

    Our D Specials had turning headlamps and power steering, and also a clock (amongst other things) which was special for Australia. Our Safari's had brown Targa on white cars which also wasn't normally available.

    There were plenty of white D Specials with blue interiors delivered in Australia. We didn't ever get Grey velour on the later DS's, but it was available.

    There are lots of rules regarding what specifically went with what, but there are lots of example to prove the rules wrong.

    It is widely accepted that all DS21's had Natural Leather, and it changed to Tobacco in Sept '71 with the introduction of flush door handles, but I know of at least one DS21 with external door handles and no headrests that has Tobacco leather from the factory?

    If your order was big enough, you could basically have any combination you wanted.

    Best regards,

    Greg
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    We Have:
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    Thank God I'm a Frenchman harrisson_citroen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    . We didn't ever get Grey velour on the later DS's, but it was available.

    Oh, dear! Just as I had promised myself not to contradict anyone, here I go again.
    D Special - blue seat covers-screen-shot-2017-01-31-9.38.35-am.jpg



    This is my DS in its original grey velours and bleu delta colour Australian delivered, 1974.
    D Special - blue seat covers-dsc00516.jpg

    The irony of it all is that I later changed the interior to.....blue
    D Special - blue seat covers-photo-22.jpg

    Just saying.
    Last edited by harrisson_citroen; 4th November 2017 at 07:51 PM.
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    good idea that grey looks revolting!

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    Thank God I'm a Frenchman harrisson_citroen's Avatar
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    Bleu Delta, interior Gris Acier,
    Ah! The brochure was correctD Special - blue seat covers-nuancier-ds-74-pallas.jpg
    DS Un jour, DS toujours !

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    Hi Guys,

    It was my mistake to say never, as I often forget that Maxim's Brisbane was the concessioner for QLD at that time, and ordered cars separately from Citco, who was the concessioner for the rest of Australia.

    Your car is obviously QLD. Jim also brought in D Super 5's, which the rest of Australia didn't get.

    As manager of Maxim Motors Sydney in 1983 / 4 (Maxims was the Citroen Concessionaire for all of Australia then), we negotiated with Citroen, and purchased the remainder of the DS seat trims that they had in stock, as there was a ready market for them in Australia at that time, but many of the Europeans DS's had gone off the road.

    There were two container loads came in, and they sold very quickly, but the grey velour was difficult to shift, as we had no cars with that interior.

    The balance of the trims not sold went to Continental cars in Sydney, and the dregs that still remained went to the boys in Gayndah.

    We were successful in negotiating the purchase of Citroen remaining stock of D Special Weber carburettors, and RHD clutch pivots.

    But I suppose that the whole purpose of my post was to show that there was always variations to the norm........There were a lot of overseas delivery cars coming into Australia at that time, and these were often English spec cars, so they tend to muddy the waters as well.

    Our DS21 EFI Hydraulic is a very late car with flush door handles and headrests, and was a private import into Maxims Old. Jim told me the story that the car was covered with a car cover while it was in the workshop, as he was still selling cars with external door handles.

    Best regards,

    Greg
    We Have:
    C5 HDI Exclusive 2.7 '09, Pluriel '09, Berlingo 1.6 HDI '10, C4 VTS coupe. C4 Picasso '08, 2CV Charleston '84 Grey, 2CV, '55 Australian delivered. 15/6 H '55, SM '74 BVM, DS21 EFI BVH, DS21 '67 BVH.
    We Had:
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  24. #24
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    Kevin Syd Ken Greg Steven you are tonights hard quiz champions.
    Harrison:

    OUT!

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    Greg,

    Great story. I hope you have already told this one to Mark, Geoff and Pam along with all the other good ones. I'll bet you keep waking up each morning with a few more stories to tell.

    Cheers, Ken

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