"France Tambour" Replacement Front Disks DS
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Thread: "France Tambour" Replacement Front Disks DS

  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! ds21bvh's Avatar
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    Default "France Tambour" Replacement Front Disks DS

    Hi all
    While looking for some replacement disks for the 21 I came across a long forgotten box of the above in my stash. I recon they would be 15-20 years old.
    IIRC there were some replacement disks many years ago that were troublesome with shuddering and less than smooth brake operation.
    Was this the brand? With all the work involved to change them if there is a chance they are an issue I'm just as happy to spring for a new set if they are better these days...
    Many thanks in advance
    Mark...

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    1000+ Posts robmac's Avatar
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    DBA (disk brakes Australia) still list disks for DS 21 models 1967 - 1972

    Online Catalogue - Disc Brakes Australia

    For interest they also list Ds 23 models from 73-75

    I've used DBA products on many vehicles and never had as much as a hint of trouble.

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    Fellow Frogger! ds21bvh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robmac View Post
    DBA (disk brakes Australia) still list disks for DS 21 models 1967 - 1972

    Online Catalogue - Disc Brakes Australia

    For interest they also list Ds 23 models from 73-75

    I've used DBA products on many vehicles and never had as much as a hint of trouble.
    Hi Rob
    I too am a fan of DBA products, however unless I've done something wrong the catalogue lists the DS but does not have a part number for them....so I'm assuming they are not available....
    cheers
    Mark...
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    1000+ Posts robmac's Avatar
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    I must confess I didn't look that far. I saw them listed 'tho.

    May be worth a call to DBA .

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    Quote Originally Posted by robmac View Post
    I must confess I didn't look that far. I saw them listed 'tho.

    May be worth a call to DBA .
    Have already - They don't make them.
    Gillian and Chris

    74 D Special, and now a 74 Pallas 23 5 speed with air(maybe). And now a Cactus!

    Oh, and a Holden.

    Lasya, Tibetan goddess of the moon and beauty who carries a mirror.

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    1000+ Posts robmac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lasya View Post
    Have already - They don't make them.
    Quelle dommage

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    Fellow Frogger! ds21bvh's Avatar
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    Hi Rob
    I checked today...no good.
    Thanks for the suggestion however, I'd not thought of it...
    Cheers
    Mark...

    Sent from my Nexus 5 using aussiefrogs mobile app

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    Fellow Frogger! Greg's Avatar
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    Hi Mark,

    DS discs were always a problem, and it's big job to replace a set that's giving trouble.

    I cheated and found a set of early discs that were made of a different steel / iron (some one will know the difference?) for our DS21. They were the type of material that never wore out (similar steel to long stoke discs).

    They are a bit hard to come by, but worth looking for.

    Best regards,

    Greg
    We Have:
    C5 HDI Exclusive 2.7 '09, Pluriel '09, Berlingo 1.6 HDI '10, C4 VTS coupe. C4 Picasso '08, 2CV Charleston '84 Grey, 2CV, '55 Australian delivered. 15/6 H '55, SM '74 BVM, DS21 EFI BVH, DS21 '67 BVH.
    We Had:
    1930C6F, '73 GS1220 wagon X 2, '75 G special, '75 GS panel van, '74 GS Birotor, '82 GSA panel van with factory AC, '85 CX25GTI BVM, 2002 C5 V6, 2006, C5 S2 HDI, '86 BX19GT, '72 DS21 BVM, '55 15/6H, '54 Lt 15,'73 Dyane, '82 Visa Super X, with Chrono Mecs & factory AC, 1972 SM.

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    "France Tambour" Replacement Front Disks DS-brakeshml.jpgHi, i have a nice set of brake disks and calipers for DS cheers, Harry Martens
    Greg, ds21bvh and GreenBlood like this.

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    Fellow Frogger! ds21bvh's Avatar
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    Hi Greg
    Many thanks for the reply and the suggestion.
    The harder disks were used from 66 to 69 model years.
    Some 70s with the alloy inner trial units had them too - they seemed to go together but of course not always.
    I have a set from a 69 ID19B here and am weighing up the effort to strip them, have them delipped and resurfaced to find they are warped or bent or something else (you know how it goes) - compared to fitting a new aftermarket set which may go south in a few 1000 km....decisions decisions...
    The 69 21 has the harder disks and I kept them, however one seems to have developed some runout so I'm not sure the earlier disks were completely immune.... were there issues with the earlier disks...?
    All the best
    Mark...

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    Hmm..... I need to look at the disks I pulled of my 1968 DS21 and have a closer look for a part number. Sounds like I might be keeping them after all.......

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    Fellow Frogger! Greg's Avatar
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    Hi Guys,

    Citco only used factory parts, and they gave very little trouble, and apart from being a dirty job, I don't remember having DS's with shudder problems as some do today.

    I know for a while at Chevron Motors, we used aftermarket clutch kits for GS's, and we ended up replacing every one with genuine units, it was a costly lesson, so after that it was OEM or nothing.

    It shouldn't be too hard to mount the discs in a lathe, on an output shaft, and see what the runout is? I have heard though that sometimes the output shaft itself can have a run out, so maybe they need to be looked at as well.

    There are some abrasive pads available from Der Franzose that you can fit instead of the pads, to tidy up the disc surface. You generally put the car up on stands at the front, fit the pads, and run the front wheels in a gear, and apply the brakes......continue until you happy with the result.

    Refit the proper pads, and take it for a drive? You can skim about four cars with a set.

    I got a few sets for Jason Hantos, and he seems too think they're with the effort, though he fits the abrasive pads, and takes the car for a slow drive?

    The other cause of shuddering brakes is not lining up the callipers with the discs, especially after working on callipers or replacing the discs.

    The calliper mounting holes are oversize, and before tightening up the mounting bolts, you need to have someone put the brakes on & tighten the mounting bolts while the brakes are applied. The pressure from the pistons onto the pads and disc align the callipers exactly.

    It surprise how many people overlook that alignment procedure.

    Hope this all helps?

    Best regards,

    Greg
    We Have:
    C5 HDI Exclusive 2.7 '09, Pluriel '09, Berlingo 1.6 HDI '10, C4 VTS coupe. C4 Picasso '08, 2CV Charleston '84 Grey, 2CV, '55 Australian delivered. 15/6 H '55, SM '74 BVM, DS21 EFI BVH, DS21 '67 BVH.
    We Had:
    1930C6F, '73 GS1220 wagon X 2, '75 G special, '75 GS panel van, '74 GS Birotor, '82 GSA panel van with factory AC, '85 CX25GTI BVM, 2002 C5 V6, 2006, C5 S2 HDI, '86 BX19GT, '72 DS21 BVM, '55 15/6H, '54 Lt 15,'73 Dyane, '82 Visa Super X, with Chrono Mecs & factory AC, 1972 SM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ds21bvh View Post
    Hi Greg
    The harder disks were used from 66 to 69 model years.
    Some 70s with the alloy inner trial units had them too - they seemed to go together but of course not always.
    I have a set from a 69 ID19B here and am weighing up the effort to strip them, have them delipped and resurfaced to find they are warped or bent or something else (you know how it goes) - compared to fitting a new aftermarket set which may go south in a few 1000 km....decisions decisions...
    The 69 21 has the harder disks and I kept them, however one seems to have developed some runout so I'm not sure the earlier disks were completely immune.... were there issues with the earlier disks...?
    All the best
    Mark...
    I checked through all the parts catalogues to see if there was any way to tell from the part numbers, which disks were hard/ soft. The part number did change from DV 451-23A to 2D 5405 273 T some time circa 70/71. Thereafter, the '2D' part number AND 'DX 451-233A' both seem to get used? Is there any particular way to tell which disks are the harder ones?

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    Fellow Frogger! Greg's Avatar
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    Yes, its easy, they will be old discs with vertually no lip (like long stroke brake discs).

    Guard them with your life.

    best regards,

    Greg
    We Have:
    C5 HDI Exclusive 2.7 '09, Pluriel '09, Berlingo 1.6 HDI '10, C4 VTS coupe. C4 Picasso '08, 2CV Charleston '84 Grey, 2CV, '55 Australian delivered. 15/6 H '55, SM '74 BVM, DS21 EFI BVH, DS21 '67 BVH.
    We Had:
    1930C6F, '73 GS1220 wagon X 2, '75 G special, '75 GS panel van, '74 GS Birotor, '82 GSA panel van with factory AC, '85 CX25GTI BVM, 2002 C5 V6, 2006, C5 S2 HDI, '86 BX19GT, '72 DS21 BVM, '55 15/6H, '54 Lt 15,'73 Dyane, '82 Visa Super X, with Chrono Mecs & factory AC, 1972 SM.

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    1000+ Posts daffyduck's Avatar
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    DS discs can be trued using a large lathe suitable for doing truck and bus discs. Find the right machine shop and it will take all of 15 minutes per disc.

    Those older discs were, I believe, hardened. They never wore out and I don't think I have ever seen a set warped. They are the most juicy salvage item from early 5 main D parts cars.
    In the last 5 years we have seen many cars with warped discs. Most are taken care of today.
    Beware: new discs out of EU are almost always off and should be skimmed before install. Once again: find the right machine shop and it is NO PROBLEM.

    Sent from my SM-G930V using aussiefrogs mobile app

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    Yes, its easy, they will be old discs with vertually no lip (like long stroke brake discs).

    Guard them with your life.

    best regards,

    Greg
    Thanks Greg. I was going to replace my 68 disks but i have changed my mind!

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    Quote Originally Posted by dsvitesse1 View Post
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	brakesHML.jpg 
Views:	115 
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ID:	98717Hi, i have a nice set of brake disks and calipers for DS cheers, Harry Martens

    I want these rotors!!!
    Gillian and Chris

    74 D Special, and now a 74 Pallas 23 5 speed with air(maybe). And now a Cactus!

    Oh, and a Holden.

    Lasya, Tibetan goddess of the moon and beauty who carries a mirror.

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