My first Citroen
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Thread: My first Citroen

  1. #1
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    Default My first Citroen

    Hi all,

    I purchased my first ever Citroen last year, a white C5 sedan. It replaced a 26 year old land cruiser which was just getting way to costly to run fuel wise. When I was scouring the dealers I was originally looking at Honda Accords, VW Passat or a Toyota Aurion, then I saw a dealer selling a C5. I was immediately impressed with the looks, build quality both inside and out, and how well it drove. I purchased that car a week later which I thought was a bargain, albeit a risky one considering i knew nothing about these cars. The dealer was selling it as a 2010 4cyl 2.0L petrol with 4 spd auto. Because there is no identifying info on the car, I took this as being correct, until I came to insure the car with Suncorp. They told me that the year/engine combination doesn't exist and they could not insure the car.

    I ended up looking for the compliance plate ( found under the boot carpet ) and did a VIN check from one of those online services. What i really got was a 2012 4cyl 1.6L THP engine with 6 speed auto. Lucky me I notice that dealer has another Citroen for sale, same year but black and a diesel at almost double the price!

    I love the comfortable seats and how it effortlessly drives on the highway. I have a couple questions for anyone living in Brisbane, if someone could throw me a few points, much appreciated!

    1. Can anyone recommend a place to do a 80,000 service that will be coming up this year? I was recommended Comet Automotive by the dealer.
    2. At low speeds ( under 40km ) if I drive with a really light foot the car seems to ping/rattle. Is this normal, or is this indicating some sensor needs changing? I'm running 95 fuel.

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  2. #2
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    Welcome to AF.

    If memory is correct those 1.6L cars came with steel spring suspension across the various fit-out grades, Attraction, Seduction, and Exclusive. Even without hydraulics they are a lovely drive and surprisingly agile for a large car with a small engine. Diesels have much more poke, and hydraulic cars an even softer ride.

    The engine is also found in high end C4s and the DS3 Dsport, as well as in some faster Peugeot models and the 508, so there is a lot of experience and information available.

    THis engine did have a problem - it can lose timing chain tension, and the giveaway is a loud rattle from the driver's side end, worse when cold. Get it replaced pronto, as chain failure can destroy the engine. Generally older early engines are most likely to be affected. Don't confuse the sound with the clicking of the four injectors at the back. If you are worried get a Citroen or Peugeot specialist to listen. At one point Citroen was replacing the chain. It needs special tools to set the timing, so a specialist mechanic is the place to go.

    Pinging is higher pitched, but gets worse when pulling. It can come from all cylinders. There is an anti-knock sensor on the engine rear which enables the computer to adjust for fuel octane.
    Last edited by seasink; 4th January 2017 at 10:59 PM. Reason: typo

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    Lucky you got the 6 speed auto because the small number of 4 speed petrol models imported in 2010 had the dreadfully unreliable AL4 autobox.

    Further to what Seasink said, the trim levels were bewildering. Some 1.6L models were imported as Exclusive trim with hydro suspension; the simple way to check whether you have hydropneumatic suspension without popping the bonnet is whether the handbrake is electric (hydro) or manual (steel).

    Looking for Citroen Service in Brisbane has some other options for servicing.
    2011 Citroen C5 - 'La Barge'

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    Ring Brisbane Citroen Service Department, give them your VIN and ask them whether there are any service campaigns outstanding on your car. We had a C4 with a THP engine and managed to get the timing chain, a temp sensor and a couple of other items replaced free of charge out of warranty.

    Do you have the 6 speed EGS or the AM6 gearbox?

    I will put in a plug for Euroserve at Newstead as an alternative service centre.

    Cheers, Ken
    dimistyle likes this.

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    I suppose anything is possible at the end of the Ateco period, but my 2012 spec sheet lists only the 6 speed auto for all 1.6L versions.

    On this list there are Hydractives for that engine in Exclusive grade, and the handbrake is a giveaway, as mentioned. Exclusives had sun blinds. Attractions had all-cloth seating without electric adjustment.

    As the 1.6 was an "entry" vehicle, being cheaper than the diesels, I suspect most were in Attraction trim.

    PS For Jeff H, the variety of C5 X7 models made, especially in Europe, is bewildering. Choices were availabe in engines, transmissions, suspensions, trim and accessories. We originally got many of them. At the end of the run in Australia we were offered none of the lower priced options.
    Last edited by seasink; 5th January 2017 at 10:21 AM.

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    Thanks all for your quick replies, and all the information, much appreciated!

    I booked in the vehicle next week with Brisbane Citroen to have a look to see if it is the timing chain. You would think the timing chain would last more than 77,000km wouldn't you.
    The VIN Report states it has a AT6 gearbox. I hope that's good?

    It's not the exclusive model, as I had a look under the wheel and it had 2 sets of springs and a torsion bar. It rides extremely well, and the engine certainly is quick enough for me. Initially I was after a car with light colour leather seats, as I'm not a fan of black interiors, and this car has black cloth seats, but the material is so good and contrast really good with the outside white colour of the paint I changed my mind about black interiors.

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    Is that the Toyota/Aisin gearbox ? If so lucky you.
    I'd doubt you would feel a need for more power or torque either.


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    A dealer is the best place to check computer updates and any recalls etc. They will be familiar with any chain problem. Most of us go to specialists elsewhere, as recommended, for repairs and maintenance because of the considerable saving in parts costs. Dealer labour can also be expensive. I wish it wasn't so.

    The AM6 6 speed auto gearbox is a smooth delight, made in Japan by Aisin Seiki and is used, configured as required, for a number of cars of that size. The maker says it is lubricated for life. Most of us are sceptical, and change the fluid at about the mileage of your car. It is much cheaper to get the fluid from Toyota, who also uses Aisin transmissions.

    Springs and all cloth seats with no electric seat positioning make it an Attraction model. The next level has part leather. The maker of the seats is Faurecia in France, whose seat products are in Mercedes, Audis, etc as well.

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    Here are the steel sprung suspensions.
    My first Citroen-cit-c5-054.jpgMy first Citroen-cit-c5-055.jpg
    Here is the 1.6 THP engine, showing the chain drive.
    My first Citroen-ep6cdt.jpg
    Last edited by seasink; 5th January 2017 at 11:58 AM.

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    Dont we change gearbox oil to stop clutch matl constantly going thru bearings and gears and tiny ports and valves

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    Quote Originally Posted by Renburg View Post
    Dont we change gearbox oil to stop clutch matl constantly going thru bearings and gears and tiny ports and valves
    Hopefully they have filters for that.

    John

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    Quote Originally Posted by JBN View Post
    Hopefully they have filters for that.

    John
    Yo John
    good to see your still on the horn

    My understanding of a valve body

    is that the stuff that gets thru the filter ,

    the sort of fine primordal ooze,

    is just the right size to jam or gum or gunk it up

    and it controls the tranny , let me talk to my trans guy , he's an Ace

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    [QUOTE=Renburg;1495363]Yo John
    good to see your still on the horn

    My understanding of a valve body

    is that the stuff that gets thru the filter ,

    the sort of fine primordal ooze,

    is just the right size to jam or gum or gunk it up

    and it controls the tranny , let me talk to my trans guy , he's an Ace

    Taking a guess the tranny filter is 60 micron to allow for flow

    The clearance on the spools of the valve body is approx 1 thou or 25 microns

    so in theory it cant work
    as your putting metal fragments

    and fine clutch material

    which in itself is abrasive , thru this area under pressure

    How they work so long
    quite hot

    and with all those electronics in them and plastic more and more , amazing

    I was horrified to see my sons car has a plastic inlet manifold

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff H View Post
    Thanks all for your quick replies, and all the information, much appreciated!

    I booked in the vehicle next week with Brisbane Citroen to have a look to see if it is the timing chain. interiors.
    Hey all,

    I dropped the car in at 8am today and they gave it a test about 5 hours later. They couldn't fault it. Perhaps my ears are hearing something that is not a timing chain but some regular noise the car exhibits, but not used to?

    It's a little hard to explain but the best way I can explain it is, if you had a manual and went up a hill in too high a gear ( meaning the engine is revving too low ) then the engine has a bit of a hissy and starts to knock and ping slightly. That's what I get going up hills at low speeds too, even when the engine is hot. It's almost like the computer is making the gears change up too quick. Does that make sense? I also discovered if I switch to sports mode, I don't get this problem at all, only in economy mode.

    Anyways the dealer wants me to leave the car overnight so they can cold start it the next day. Do you think it's worth doing this?

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    Yes. If you have dud timing or chain, the noise is quite audible cold.

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    Quote Originally Posted by seasink View Post
    Yes. If you have dud timing or chain, the noise is quite audible cold.
    Wow this is a busy forum. I had to go down a few pages to find my original post!

    I left the car overnight and the dealer tells me that it is *not* the timing chain, even though they acknowledge that the car does have a ping/rattle/surge at about 40km. They wanted to keep the car for a few more days for more diagnostics, but since they charged me $180 to tell me it wasn't the timing chain, I figure this might get expensive and its probably just a dirty sensor somewhere and just not bother with it and see if the 80,000 km service fixes it.

    Anyone have any hints what else could be wrong?

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