Is LHM every clear?
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    Fellow Frogger! Big Frog's Avatar
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    Default Is LHM every clear?

    I have only ever used Total LHM in litre bottles, which is green.
    I have been supplied some in bulk and it is clear?
    Do I just add food colouring to suit? ( just kidding)

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    Now go make me a sandwich Hotrodelectric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Frog View Post
    I have only ever used Total LHM in litre bottles, which is green.
    I have been supplied some in bulk and it is clear?
    Do I just add food colouring to suit? ( just kidding)
    What were you supplied? I know there was a spec of Lubriplate that very closely mimicked LHM in most respects except it is clear, where LHM is dyed green. I forget the spec number- 8803, I think? Citroenfan will know. Don't use the off-brand fluid until you can be sure of what it is.
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    UFO
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    What brand LHM is it? Curious...
    Craig K
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    Add colouring only if it's LHM Big Frog, only if it's LHM. As UFO has asked, what brand is it and you'll need to check the specs as Hotrodelectric advises. I bought 40 litres last year (bulk enough?) and it's all Green!

    Regards,

    John

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Frog View Post
    I have only ever used Total LHM in litre bottles, which is green.
    I have been supplied some in bulk and it is clear?
    Do I just add food colouring to suit? ( just kidding)

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    JBN
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    Drink it and see if you pee is still yellow.

    John
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    Quote Originally Posted by JBN View Post
    Drink it and see if you pee is still yellow.

    John
    Apparently you will pee green fluid if you drink the stuff. There's a picture floating around which shows this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Frog View Post
    I have only ever used Total LHM in litre bottles, which is green.
    I have been supplied some in bulk and it is clear?
    Do I just add food colouring to suit? ( just kidding)
    First off - regardless of supplier or manufacturer the base oil, if you will, that is finally converted into any hydraulic oil comes out of the refining columns as a slightly amber colored liquid. That you got a bulk container of 'LHM' from Total that is not fluorescent green (and we have to guess that it says 'LHM' on the outside of the container and that the correct catalog number for 'LHM' is also printed on the container) means somewhere in the production process something got screwed upped. Either the batch of material used to fill the containers, one of which you got, was actually made to LHM specifications and the green dye not added (not good from a QC standpoint) or it is a hydraulic fluid not made to LHM specifications and put into LHM marked cans (again not good from a QC standpoint).

    In either case you need to contact your supplier and let them know. In addition to the actual product (catalog) number that should be printed on the container - careful looking should also turn up a production or batch number (code). You supplier can tell you where to look or they should have it in their records. That code can then be used to back track the cans to the factory. And I really doubt you are the first one to have noticed this .

    My first guess is that somewhere in the production someone pushed the wrong button and the batch that was used to fill those containers in not LHM. The small and large containers of LHM are all filled from the same production lots.

    Contact your supplier and have them replace what they sent you - just have them make sure what they send you is from a different production run. They are going to need that can in any event.
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    Fellow Frogger! Big Frog's Avatar
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    Hi all,
    The fluid was supplied in a non original container as it was decanted from a 200 l drum.
    I checked with the supplier , ( who I won't name), they insisted that it is indeed LHM and that it is fine.
    They are a very well regarded Citroen person. However I can't bring myself to use the fluid and will return it, the last thing I need is a contaminated system and will err on the side of caution.

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    Isn't LHS clear?

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    Now go make me a sandwich Hotrodelectric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by seasink View Post
    Isn't LHS clear?
    Sort of a reddish yellow, IIRC. That could be simple DOT3, though. I understand the original stuff- HD19- was actually red.
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    Now go make me a sandwich Hotrodelectric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JBN View Post
    Drink it and see if you pee is still yellow.

    John
    Quote Originally Posted by daffyduck View Post
    Apparently you will pee green fluid if you drink the stuff. There's a picture floating around which shows this.
    Yes, but does it have that asparagus smell?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Frog View Post
    Hi all,
    The fluid was supplied in a non original container as it was decanted from a 200 l drum.
    I checked with the supplier , ( who I won't name), they insisted that it is indeed LHM and that it is fine.
    They are a very well regarded Citroen person. However I can't bring myself to use the fluid and will return it, the last thing I need is a contaminated system and will err on the side of caution.

    Regardless of their protestations - if it ain't 'green' it is not LHM. The fluorescent green color is part and partial of the LHM specification and has been since it was introduced - regardless of size. Have them send you a picture of the 200 liter drum of fluid that this material came from - I doubt seriously you will find it has 'LHM' printed anywhere on it ......

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    Sounds like Pentosin (7.1 LHM) to me. They call it 7.7LHM.
    It is a hydraulic AWS32 or similar, which is amber/clear.
    Maybe OK for my MB, but not for something as sophisticated as a hydro pneumatic precision machine like a DS.
    googleit for more info.

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    Contented Peugeot Driver addo's Avatar
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    I suspect this was something like the reference Bill made:

    Revised Summary of CitroŽn Hydraulic Fluids
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    Now go make me a sandwich Hotrodelectric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilrex View Post
    Sounds like Pentosin (7.1 LHM) to me. They call it 7.7LHM.
    It is a hydraulic AWS32 or similar, which is amber/clear.
    Maybe OK for my MB, but not for something as sophisticated as a hydro pneumatic precision machine like a DS.
    googleit for more info.

    Rex B
    It's not so much the Mercedes system isn't sophisticated as it is extensive. For instance, the system on my 300 wagon is hydraulic in the rear only, as a load-levelling feature. But the ride is as smooth over certain surfaces as a later D.

    As I remember it, there's two different versions of Pentosin CHF. Th earlier, 7.1 was allegedly compatible with LHM. When I had my CX, I had considered and later rejected it, not being able to figure out whether or not is was a suitable fluid. The newer stuff (7.8?) I think is supposed to be like LDS. Mercedes of course, not missing a branding opportunity markets hydraulic fluid for their cars. I think that fluid is made by Febi.
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    JBN
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hotrodelectric View Post
    Yes, but does it have that asparagus smell?
    I don't smell my own pee. If I smell the pee of another dog, I pee over the top of it.

    Life is a bitch and the last to pee gets the bitch.

    John

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    Quote Originally Posted by wilrex View Post
    Sounds like Pentosin (7.1 LHM) to me. They call it 7.7LHM.
    It is a hydraulic AWS32 or similar, which is amber/clear.
    Maybe OK for my MB, but not for something as sophisticated as a hydro pneumatic precision machine like a DS.
    googleit for more info.

    Rex B

    Based on Pentosin's own MSDS for 7.1 HF it is green in color and a match for LHM+ specifications. Same VI and 40C viscosity. When I did a search for 7.7 - got nothing except for re-directs to cHF 202 - The funny thing is that in the latest Pentosin Cat. I could fine on the net, 'Pentosin Technical Fluids for Cars and Light Trucks - 2014' - PSA cars are not even mentioned.......Only two products are mentioned in the synthetic Hydraulic Oil area, 202 and 11F. Both are colored dark green and have product specifications that are in the same range as the original LHM, but a bit inferior in VI (not by much).

    Really does not matter for me being in the USA - been using Lubriplate -70 for a long time and recently found a source in England for a green oil soluble dye. Does make it a lot, lot easier to see in the site tube........

    Steve

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    Now go make me a sandwich Hotrodelectric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citroenfan View Post
    Really does not matter for me being in the USA - been using Lubriplate -70 for a long time and recently found a source in England for a green oil soluble dye. Does make it a lot, lot easier to see in the site tube........

    Steve
    Not to mention on the ground.

    Yes, I know. You'll see me at AGM. You can smack me upside the head then.
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    Further to this discussion, I find that the LHM added to my car in recent service visits appears to be almost clear. The top up 1 litre containers I bought home also appear to be clear-to-greenish in colour but is definitely labelled as LHM Plus and recommended for Citroen among other "Modern European Vehicles ... where ISO 7308" is recommended.

    This oil is supplied by Penrite Oil Company (Victoria). They describe its colour on the container as being green but it's nowhere near the distinctive bright green we are accustomed to from Total.

    Does anyone have knowledge/experience of this product over an extensive period of use?

    Thanks,

    Ken

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    Quote Originally Posted by kenlin View Post
    Further to this discussion, I find that the LHM added to my car in recent service visits appears to be almost clear. The top up 1 litre containers I bought home also appear to be clear-to-greenish in colour but is definitely labelled as LHM Plus and recommended for Citroen among other "Modern European Vehicles ... where ISO 7308" is recommended.

    This oil is supplied by Penrite Oil Company (Victoria). They describe its colour on the container as being green but it's nowhere near the distinctive bright green we are accustomed to from Total.

    Does anyone have knowledge/experience of this product over an extensive period of use?

    Thanks,

    Ken

    Ken,

    Having an ISO 7308 designation gives you very little info other than the the fluid is not recommended for Arctic use (below -30C) and will not harm sealing materials made of Nitrile rubber (the ones found in green fluid Cits). Other than that you are going to be pretty much in the dark .

    I looked up the materials actual specifications and is, for all intents and purposes, a dead ringer for Total's LHM Plus. With both your observation and that of others, is it possible that some suppliers are cutting back on the green dye because of cost????? . Also interesting is that Penrite seems to have a fluid compatible with LDS - they refer to it as a 'synthetic LHM" - not mineral fluid based.

    http://tinyurl.com/jtjnjsk - fluid info

    http://tinyurl.com/gv4cbjx - pdf on Penrite fluids

    Steve

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    It still all leaks over the concrete! Regulator about to get new o rings...
    I've been buying Penrite 1 litres to nurse Xantia through crisis and its pretty green Ken.
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    Thanks Steve and Steven. Yes, sadly it still drips given half a chance, or some dead o-rings, or pipe seals, or ... .

    Yes, I think there is a tinge of green in the Penrite LHM but I find it to be very light and the colour not apparent if placed on the fingers. My point in raising it here was that it might have been the LHM Plus referred to by Big Frog at the start of this thread. Did not look green, to me at least but if it's Penrite, then it should be OK to use in our Citroens, the Pride and Joy.

    Ken

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    Quote Originally Posted by kenlin View Post
    Thanks Steve and Steven. Yes, sadly it still drips given half a chance, or some dead o-rings, or pipe seals, or ... .

    Yes, I think there is a tinge of green in the Penrite LHM but I find it to be very light and the colour not apparent if placed on the fingers. My point in raising it here was that it might have been the LHM Plus referred to by Big Frog at the start of this thread. Did not look green, to me at least but if it's Penrite, then it should be OK to use in our Citroens, the Pride and Joy.

    Ken
    Ken,

    LHM or LHM+ when you place a thin film of it on your fingers does not look all that green either . As a point of reference the basic difference between the two fluids is the viscosity index - or a measure of how well the fluid resists changes in its overall viscosity as its temperature changes. LHM was/is 320 - LHM+ is 340. Other attributes are same. Always have to laugh when I see some of our European suppliers touting the fact that they have 'original' LHM - as though it somehow is a big deal. Cheaper to make (a bit) and then sold for a higher price......

    Regards the dripping PR. Only a couple of places the steel bodied units fail. Most typical is one of the line seals. OTOH, with the unit themselves, the typical failure point is the upper caps 0-ring. The upper caps spring controls the cut-0ut pressure of the unit. Not very common, but have seen it happen on occasion. And while you are at it, have the pressure of the accumulator sphere checked. If low or flat, the line feeding the PR from the HP pump can take a real beating as that sphere also provides dampening back to the HP pump from pressure pluses out of the PR when it goes from pressure to by-pass mode. Additionally, and not something you have to worry about, is that those un-dampened pressure pulses can fracture the Al bodies of the older style 7 piston pumps.

    Steve

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    I've sniffed out this one thanks Steve, smells like LHM, have seals just need time.

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    Fellow Frogger! Big Frog's Avatar
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    Any tips on suppliers of Total LHM, preferably someone who ships direct. All sorts of parts shops 'can get it' but there are usually extra freight charges etc. Recently quoted $54 for 1 litre.
    So who's your favourite supplier?
    Last edited by Big Frog; 14th April 2016 at 01:33 PM.

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