Tell me about Xantias
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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Default Tell me about Xantias

    I'm looking at Xantias as they seem to be as unloved in the marketplace as BXs, but being newer (and still being made in Iran of all places) perhaps easier to get parts for. They seem better built than a BX as well, but of course heavier. Not really interested in the Activas as they are even more unloved by insurance companies..

    I've been trawling for info on Xantias sold in Oz. So far all I have done is get more confused.

    So, here's my questions:

    Whats the difference between SX & VSX?

    Whats an Image?

    When did Series 2 arrive here?

    When did the 16v replace the 8v?

    Did we ever get the 112Kw 16vs?

    Do they all have ABS, or only some models?

    Which ones have Hydra active II?

    Any known gotchas, comments, advice etc welcome.

    Barry.

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  2. #2
    Tadpole
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    Barry,

    They're a bit more common over here in the UK so I can answer most of your questions!

    >Whats the difference between SX & VSX?

    VSX gets a slightly better radio, alloys and hydractive suspension. Possibly one or 2 other toys like variable delay wipers.

    >Whats an Image?

    No idea!

    >When did Series 2 arrive here?

    Available in the UK from late '98, so imagine they got to Oz a bit later.

    >When did the 16v replace the 8v?

    Probably about '96

    >Did we ever get the 112Kw 16vs?

    This engine was only available for a short time early in the Xantia's life, so maybe in Oz, maybe not!

    >Do they all have ABS, or only some models?

    Standard on SX up after late 94, probably standard on all series 2 cars.

    >Which ones have Hydra active II?

    VSX

    >Any known gotchas, comments, advice etc welcome

    Radiators rot away (although possibly not as bad over your way due to less salt on the roads). Heater matrixes tend to go at about 100k miles - dash out to replace!. If you get a manual box, the clutch cable is joined to the pedal with a plastic clip which eventually breaks - changing it takes 3 hours plus as Cit decided to fit the pedal bolt in such a way that you can't get it out and have to saw it off. Alarms can be temperamental - especially if you get a not-uncommon water leak into the passenger foot well - where the alarm ECU resides. Rear height correctors seize up, but prob less of a problem in Oz again due to less salt. Changing the clutch is an absolute pig of a job. Headlightes are pretty woeful by design.

    On the up side they are very quiet and comfortable, and very well screwed together (no trim rattles in mine at 100k miles - I went looking for a small rattle in the boot as it was annoying me last month!). I am well pleased with mine, even though it has been giving me a bit of maintenance headache the last couple of months. I hope to nurse it through!

    Richard (95 Xantia LX TD)

  3. #3
    Member Sputnik's Avatar
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    Hi Barry,

    There are far better qualified people to advise but as an owner here's my

    >Whats an Image?

    I think the 'Image' was a base level designation that replaced the label 'SX'.

    You may also see 75th anniversary models (like mine) - they are base models with extra fruit like sunroof, automatic wipers, climate control etc but not other VSX features like hydractive.

    >When did Series 2 arrive here?

    My car is an October 1998 series 2, so the introduction must have been close to the UK date.

    >When did the 16v replace the 8v?

    Not sure, but it was not introduced (here at least) in the automatics. The outputs don't look much different on paper, but i've been told the 16V is considerably more sprightly than the 8V

    >Did we ever get the 112Kw 16vs?

    Nope. (bugger)

    >Any known gotchas, comments, advice etc welcome

    The clutch cable 'feature' to which Richard refers was not changed in the series 2.

    My car has done 130,000km and has been faultlessly reliable. Has lived outside much of it's life - the paintwork has suffered a little but the interior has not died from UV overload. It is a very nice car to steer, rides beautifully (erm except when the spheres go - you will know!). I think it is geared more for the highway & economy - you won't win too many drags but it has plenty in reserve on the highway. I got < 7l/100k with air con on all the way down to Geelong @ Xmas.

    With the seats down they can carry a lot of gear - i believe this is also true of the BX.

    make sure any car you buy has had the cambelt changed promptly at 80,000km because as anyone here will tell you the consequences of not doing so don't bear thinking about.

    Best of luck in your search
    Last edited by Sputnik; 30th March 2004 at 04:25 PM.
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  4. #4
    Fellow Frogger! Paul Smith's Avatar
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    Barry wrote

    Any known gotchas, comments, advice etc welcome
    Don't forget the dreaded strut mount failure - I saw the remains of a Xantia strut today at European Autocare that had failed without any great warning, while being driven. (It had done 250,000+kms) . The only thing that stopped the bonnet being completely destroyed was the wheel hitting the underside of the wing.

    Apparently it is much harder to inspect and diagnose a failing Xantia strut, than an XM, so I would say a replacement at 150,000+kms is a must. (Also Hydractives have different strut mounts to ordinary cars - different size pipes).


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  5. #5
    1000+ Posts PeterT's Avatar
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    I have a 8V early '97 Xantia (build 12/96). It was the last of 8V engines. It's a great car but I hate the ratios in the auto. They're just too long, especially the 2-3 gap. You'd think the torque of the 8V could cope. I'm thinking of changing to 195/55/15 tyres to reduce the overall gearing a tad. I wish I had the Turbo version.

    Like them all, beware of rear spheres failing through poor maintenance. The other tell tale, is the time it takes to come up to pressure. Excessively long means the accumulator sphere is weak too.
    Last edited by PeterT; 30th March 2004 at 10:34 PM.

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  6. #6
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterT
    I have a 8V early '97 Xantia (build 12/96). It was the last of 8V engines. It's a great car but I hate the ratios in the auto. They're just too long, especially the 2-3 gap. You'd think the torque of the 8V could cope. I'm thinking of changing to 195/55/15 tyres to reduce the overall gearing a tad. I wish I had the Turbo version.

    Like them all, beware of rear spheres failing through poor maintenance. The other tell tale, is the time it takes to come up to pressure. Excessively long means the accumulator sphere is weak too.
    Yep,

    the gearing is quite high, however it has a big positive. It greatly increases the overtaking power from 80 - 120km/h as 2nd gear will hold to 120km/h.

    Actually the lift time isn't tied back to sphere condition to any great extent. Infact a car with dead spheres will raise almost immediatly. The reason?? All the sphere's are already full of LHM, there is no accumulators to charge, no spheres to pump LHM into etc. All the pressure made by the pump goes to immediatly lift the car rather than filling spheres.

    A 5spd Xantia with daravi stearing and *without* that stupid (frightening) spring under it's brake pedal would be bloody fantastic, especially the VSX models.

    Oneday I'd love to replace Angs car with an activa (possibly a CT turbo). Why 'o' why didn't they put daravi steering in these, instead of that undergeared PAS The daravi steering is just sooooo much better than the ungeared crap they force on us with all cars

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    Last edited by DoubleChevron; 31st March 2004 at 11:07 AM.
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  7. #7
    Fellow Frogger!
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    OK, I think I have got it now.

    Better to get a VSX rather than SX/Image. Bugger all difference in price now, but VSX was $45k vs $40k for SX/Image.

    Probably worth hunting down a 16v rather than an 8v.

    The price jump to post 1998 for series 2 is probably not worth it.

    Service history is everything if you want reliability as a daily driver.

    Thanks everyone for your inputs. I'm also widening my search to 405, inc mi16 & BXs, just to see what is out there.

    Barry.

  8. #8
    Member XantiaHead's Avatar
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    Hi BarryG,

    As someone who has driven a 1997 Xantia VSX 16 valve (Series 1), and own a 1999 Series 2 Xantia SX 16 valve, I would definitely recommend that you go for a Series 2 version of the Xantia (1998 onwards from memory - visually the Series 2 can be identified by its revised bonnet and grille and body-coloured panel between the rear lights).

    The reason for my view is that the Series 2 is structurally superior - the bodyshell was revised to meet Euro rollover requirements. Without going into all the detail, the bodyshell has better strength and rigidity - apart from the obvious safety benefits, it means that the vehicle is less prone to rattles and squeaks (something I did note with the Series 1).

    In addition, the interior of the Series was revised. The dashboard, while outwardly similar to the Series 1, is made of better quality materials, and the various controls do seem to operate more smoothly. Also, during the life of the Series 2 (early 1999 for models reaching Oz) twin airbags were introduced.

    Having driven both VSX and SX models, I personally feel that the Hydractive option offered by the VSX is of marginal benefit for the added complication that the system provides. The standard hydraulic system offered by the SX seems to meet 99% of driving situations.

    Hope this helps...

    Andrew

  9. #9
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleChevron
    Yep,

    A 5spd Xantia with daravi stearing and *without* that stupid (frightening) spring under it's brake pedal would be bloody fantastic, especially the VSX models.

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    Not recommending of course, but..... I removed the "stupid" spring by pulling out the plastic housing, dismantling it and replacing with about a 3/4 nut with the edges ground off. Result is rock hard pedal and all the right feeling in the brakes. The springs are terrible.

    I'm very happy with my 8V engine and 5 spd box, nice ratios and a flat torque curve is what you need I reckon.

    Our 96 Xantia has no ABS and simple suspension. Good combination I reckon.
    Lovely car.

    JohnW

  10. #10
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    John (and anyone in WA interested) that one in Allpikes is now $18,999. 1999 -described as 'top of the range' with alloys, leather, one owner. I didn't have a look because I now need to replace my car before the wife's, and I know if it was good I'd want it, but that's not the sort of car I want for my 'funabout'. Good for the wife, though, and for the family...

    Things are looking good come the right time though. What a great value car for what you get! I'm dropping hints to the wife on a regular basis - 'there's one, ooooh, nice'! Subliminal suggestion. By the time we're up for it, she'll already think she has one.

    Stuey

  11. #11
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuey
    John (and anyone in WA interested) that one in Allpikes is now $18,999. 1999 -described as 'top of the range' with alloys, leather, one owner. I didn't have a look because I now need to replace my car before the wife's, and I know if it was good I'd want it, but that's not the sort of car I want for my 'funabout'. Good for the wife, though, and for the family...

    Things are looking good come the right time though. What a great value car for what you get! I'm dropping hints to the wife on a regular basis - 'there's one, ooooh, nice'! Subliminal suggestion. By the time we're up for it, she'll already think she has one.

    Stuey
    I noticed!! It's a nice car, very well priced for what you get and has a factory sunroof. If I didn't have mine with 37,000 on the clock, I'd look very seriously at it. If it had been there two years ago when I bought mine, it might have won!!!

    What a buy. Can't understand why no-one has snapped it up.

    JOhnW

  12. #12
    1000+ Posts Warwick's Avatar
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    The image is the 16V. Did we get that far?
    The Sx is nicer to drive than the VSX, which had alcantara trim on the seats, and crazy pin no. keypad, and bigger alloys standard.
    The VSX was crap to drive. It took a big dump in the rear as you waited at traffic lights and wasn't as all round comfy.
    The image is the second best Xantia, behind the Activa.

    Activa was the best. And if the turbo was boosted up it was grouse. I boosted mine from 7 psi to 11, and the car was transformed. It'd cost too much for you though wouldn't it.

  13. #13
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warwick2
    The image is the 16V. Did we get that far?
    The Sx is nicer to drive than the VSX, which had alcantara trim on the seats, and crazy pin no. keypad, and bigger alloys standard.
    The VSX was crap to drive. It took a big dump in the rear as you waited at traffic lights and wasn't as all round comfy.
    The image is the second best Xantia, behind the Activa.

    Activa was the best. And if the turbo was boosted up it was grouse. I boosted mine from 7 psi to 11, and the car was transformed. It'd cost too much for you though wouldn't it.
    Are you kidding I have a VSX and it's bloody brilliant to drive. It was quite harsh at it's rear HA sphere was flat, this I replaced with a standard accumulator and now it dumps up & down in the rear as you have described. The fix is simple FIT THE CORRECT SPHERES !!!! I betcha someone had fitted an accumulator to the car in question that you had driven You need to drive a variety of cars before writting one sort off as *crap* Yep the pin number key pad is annoying but can easily be dissabled. h

    seeya,
    Shane L.
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  14. #14
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleChevron
    Are you kidding I have a VSX and it's bloody brilliant to drive. It was quite harsh at it's rear HA sphere was flat, this I replaced with a standard accumulator and now it dumps up & down in the rear as you have described. The fix is simple FIT THE CORRECT SPHERES !!!! I betcha someone had fitted an accumulator to the car in question that you had driven You need to drive a variety of cars before writting one sort off as *crap* Yep the pin number key pad is annoying but can easily be dissabled. h

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    Depends on your point of view doesn't it? I reckon Xantias are terrific cars. Some might have better combined sets of features, and then it depends what is available and in what condition and what mileage. I'm delighted with a 2.0 8V SX, but maybe I'm easily pleased! It hasn't too much to go wrong or be difficult to diagnose.

    I'd like a V6 manual, with a factory sunroof and non-activa hydraulics, low mileage and one careful owner........ But I'd not call any of them poor. Some might have more to go wrong than others. But each person has different tolerance of these different combinations.

    Any well-looked-after Xantia is going to be a good buy because of the depreciation. Especially when that brake spring is removed!

    That's my two bob's worth.


    JohnW

  15. #15
    Fellow Frogger! BW205's Avatar
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    Did we ever get the Activa in Oz??

    Cheers
    Billy
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by BW205
    Did we ever get the Activa in Oz??

    Cheers
    Billy
    Yes we did
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  17. #17
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    I have just completed a 1700Km round trip in my 95' Xantia VSX, from Toowoomba to Blackall(location of the Black Stump) and back cost $125 in fuel all up, air con on all the way.

    I can only rave about my xantia, has its woes every now and then, never anything too major


    G

  18. #18
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    Shane (or someone else), would you mind explaining this daravi steering? Never even heard of it, but would be interested to see what the difference is between it and standard ol PS?

    Cheers,
    Nick

  19. #19
    Fellow Frogger! Paul Smith's Avatar
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    Hi Nick,

    from the following site

    http://www.ccc-uk.demon.co.uk/ccc-sm.htm

    Steering:
    DIRAVI or Varipower - a system that offered speed related variable assistance and powered return of the wheels to the straight ahead position providing an unparalleled combination of very light and precise steering at low speeds and unerring stability at high speeds


    Diravi was fitted to SMs (in its most 'pure' form) then to CXs and to very few early LHD XM V6s. It also occurs in a few Maseratis - the Khamsin being one. It was progressively detuned, i.e. the ratio was reduced to make it feel more normal. In a good CX or SM the wheel will return to the straight ahead even with the engine off. The speed variable part of the steering is actually controlled by a mechanical take-off from the speedo drive. (On the Khamsin it is a tiny belt driven regulator mounted on the diff!).

    Until you have driven it for a while you just can't believe how easy it is to use.

    Paul
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  20. #20
    Good Sport danielsydney's Avatar
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    xantias are very much underated and very much unloved in australia, theya re great cars.....

  21. #21
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by danielsydney
    xantias are very much underated and very much unloved in australia, theya re great cars.....
    You're an educated man. Lucky there aren't too many more, or we'd have to pay more for our Xantias. There again, we might have had more to choose from....

    JohnW

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