RHD ID brakes
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Thread: RHD ID brakes

  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! Don B. Cilly's Avatar
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    Default RHD ID brakes

    I'm reading that,
    "the breaks, which were IDs, always used the DS brake system "
    whereas,
    "RHD IDs had a mushroom brake pedal but with the simpler ID brake hydraulics"

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    Now, as it's likely there's quite a few people on this forum who have RHD IDs, I thought I'd ask. All of them?

  2. #2
    Fellow Frogger! ds21bvh's Avatar
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    Hi Don,

    Post about 1970/71 in Australia all DSpecials got DS brakes without the extra accumulator. DSupers were not imported in huge numbers here.

    The only RHD cars I've seen here with ID brake valves in are pre 1970 model year cars.

    Cheers,

    Mark...

  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger! Don B. Cilly's Avatar
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    Well, this page seems to imply that all RHD IDs had the mushroom.

    There is also an interesting bit on the Nuancier's about an Australian model called the Parisienne, between 1961 and 1966, where it also says:
    "the Spare Pieces catalog mentions that french IDs for exportation (RHD) had "DS style" brake pedals, starting in Oct 62."

    For some reason this is puzzling me

  4. #4
    Fellow Frogger! ds21bvh's Avatar
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    Hi Don,
    Just to unpack this a little.
    All RHD D's in Aus with fully powered brakes got the mushroom. The only thing I'm not sure of is the locally assembled ID.
    For LHM cars this is the case, however 1969 model years and earlier got the ID brake valve, whereas later models got the DS trolley brake valve.
    It's conceivable that IDs later than 69 got the ID brake valve but I've not seen one...The 70 DSuper I had for a short time I thought had DS brakes...
    Cheers,
    Mark...

  5. #5
    Fellow Frogger! Lasya's Avatar
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    Default

    So how difficult would it be to change a Special with the mushroom pedal to the full DS brake system, getting the system to be load dependent front to rear?
    Gillian and Chris

    74 D Special, and now a 74 Pallas 23 5 speed with air(maybe). And now a Cactus!

    Oh, and a Holden.

    Lasya, Tibetan goddess of the moon and beauty who carries a mirror.

  6. #6
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Don B. Cilly View Post
    Well, this page seems to imply that all RHD IDs had the mushroom.

    There is also an interesting bit on the Nuancier's about an Australian model called the Parisienne, between 1961 and 1966, where it also says:
    "the Spare Pieces catalog mentions that french IDs for exportation (RHD) had "DS style" brake pedals, starting in Oct 62."

    For some reason this is puzzling me
    Australian assembled IDs (known as Parisienne) had a pedal until 1963 when the mushroom was introduced.
    roger

  7. #7
    Fellow Frogger! Don B. Cilly's Avatar
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    Fascinating. Intriguing. Mysterious. Puzzly-wuzzly.
    Heffalumps and woozles... One wonders about the logic, the marketing, the oddity... even the engineering.

    Anyone from the British Isles got any news on this?

    There was this mushroom-picking expedition of mine in England and Wales in 1980...

  8. #8
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Hi Roger,

    Absolutely correct. My 1962 Parisienne has pedal but my 1965 (model year) Parisienne has mushroom. I believe the earliest cars may have had the earlier pedal version with the "lockout" emergency stop valve, I am sure I have heard tales of that with the earliest of Aussie IDS (mind you mine rolled off the line in about Mar/Apr/may 62, only less than 9 months after production began).

    Regards Leconte.

    ps. My brakes are royally stuffed at present (on the '62). Attempted to adjust the (not really holding) handbrake on the weekend and found that the near side brake pads are completely worn, one (the moveable side) looks down to the metal and the other well under the 3mm minimum ( less than 2 mm). Hence the handbrake is completely out of adjustment and it looks like that side is leaking RR363, possibly due to over extension of the pistons. Oh the joys of buying 50 yo cars.
    1962 Heidelberg ID19 "Axel"
    1965 Heidelberg ID19
    half owner 1974 GS 1220 Convertisseur Break

  9. #9
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    The ID system does load bias to the rear. It's a brilliant system that is used on the CX/SM/GS/BX/Xantia/XM/etc.... Quite simply, the pressure source for the rear brakes is the rear suspension circuit. If there is no weight in the back, there is no pressure to operator the back brakes. If there is a loaded car trailer on your towbar, you'll get massive hydraulic pressure feeding the rear brakes

    I can't see a reason to move over to the DS trolley valve from a functional perspective. I think if they'd designed the ID system first, they would never have bothered with the DS's.

    seeya
    Shane L.
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    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
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    Yay ... No Slugomatics


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  10. #10
    Fellow Frogger! Lasya's Avatar
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    Well, thought stopped then!
    Gillian and Chris

    74 D Special, and now a 74 Pallas 23 5 speed with air(maybe). And now a Cactus!

    Oh, and a Holden.

    Lasya, Tibetan goddess of the moon and beauty who carries a mirror.

  11. #11
    Fellow Frogger!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leconte View Post
    Hi Roger,

    Absolutely correct. My 1962 Parisienne has pedal but my 1965 (model year) Parisienne has mushroom. I believe the earliest cars may have had the earlier pedal version with the "lockout" emergency stop valve, I am sure I have heard tales of that with the earliest of Aussie IDS (mind you mine rolled off the line in about Mar/Apr/may 62, only less than 9 months after production began).

    Regards Leconte.
    The change from the assisted master cylinder system to the powered system occurred in France in September '61 according to Citroen Note Technique No.7-D, dated 13 November '61. So it is almost certain that the earliest Heidelberg cars had the former (hopeless) system.
    roger

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