Ds heat shield
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Thread: Ds heat shield

  1. #1
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    Default Ds heat shield

    Hi all

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    I'm a fairly new ds owner and working my way through the bugs on my 74 Pallas carby. This forum has some great advice. Any suggestions on how I can stop the heat inside the vehicle. It seems to be transmitted via the steering column and I was wondering if wrapping the column with an adhesive shield may be an answer?

    thoughts....

  2. #2
    Fellow Frogger! Dave Rogers's Avatar
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    Peter, I know to which you refer. My 74 Pallas carby (snap) used to get so hot, particularly in the front seats, that my wife used to sit in the back on anything but a cold day. Summer driving was not a please tell experience. I've recently completed a thorough tidy up and repainted and part of the job was to address the cabin temperature problem. Following Double Chevron's (Shane)success with cooling his CX I purchased a roll of the following insulating mat from the States.
    http://www.lobucrod.com. One roll was enough for the DS. I sheathed the entire interior of the car including all behind the dashboard
    Ds heat shield-imageuploadedbytapatalk1434807219.014155.jpg
    And sheathed to steering column as you have suggested
    Ds heat shield-imageuploadedbytapatalk1434807279.685710.jpg
    I haven't been as scientific as Shane in measuring before and after temperatures but I can report a significant drop in cabin temperature (and also a pleasant tell drop in noise as well). Since completing the job I've driven Melbourne to Adelaide return and Melbourne to Sydney return and I cannot tell you how much easier long drives are now. The metal plate under the dashboard and immediately above the driver's legs used to get almost too hot to touch, now it barely gets warm. I can't say whether you'd get the same temperature reduction I've got simply by sheathing the steering column, but certainly a lot of heat does get transferred to the cabin by the column on right hand drive cars because it has to be located so close to the exhaust manifold.
    Give me a PM with your contact details if you want further info.
    Cheers,
    Dave.
    74/75 DS23 Pallas 5 Speed Carby

    83 2CV Charleston and an 89 Dolly (in NZ)

    80 GSA - ready to restore
    03 Peugeot 406 Hdi
    01 Renault Scenic

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    Fellow Frogger! badabec's Avatar
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    Hello, that stuff is on my ebay watch list, how long was your roll? 10 feet, 25 feet or 50 feet?

    Thanks

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    Fellow Frogger! Balki's Avatar
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    That photo dave looks like my safari, just fininshed doing this to it yesterdayDs heat shield-47.jpg

  5. #5
    BVH Roger Wilkinson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterMol View Post
    Any suggestions on how I can stop the heat inside the vehicle. It seems to be transmitted via the steering column and I was wondering if wrapping the column with an adhesive shield may be an answer?
    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Rogers View Post
    And sheathed to steering column as you have suggested
    First, welcome, Peter.

    Second, to all of you, I had never thought of the steering column itself as a heat conductor. How much of the heat do you reckon is conducted by the steel tube of the steering column and how much goes up the inside of the tube? If most of it goes up the inside of the tube then you could make a less visible solution than wrapping the outside of the tube by cutting the tube and filling it with the insulation, then welding it back together. Just a thought.

    Roger

  6. #6
    mnm
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    Croak croak... mnm's Avatar
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    I noticed with my car, hot air was blowing through the tube in the forward bulkhead that the steering column passes through. I stuffed it with some foil back fibre insulation I had lying around. There were also several small screw holes in the forward bulk head where hot air would blow through into the cabin... it felt like the heater was on. I lined everything with the foil pictured above, sealed up the holes and it has made a huge difference.

    Matthew

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    Fellow Frogger! Lasya's Avatar
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    Wot Dave Rogers said. I've just installed a layer of a resonance matting on MOST of the firewall, but not all, but have put that insulating mat Dave mentions over almost all (because of the test on the CX by shane) I only put 1 layer over the resonance matting and now in Tassie this winter it's too cold.... I can't remember how much I purchased, but it cost $200 delivered (I only used half, Bauke took on the rest). I used it on the firewall, the exhaust hump, the sills and other bits and pieces and it's made a huge difference to heat and noise.

    Just Do It.
    Gillian and Chris

    74 D Special, and now a 74 Pallas 23 5 speed with air(maybe).

    Oh, and a Holden and a Suzuki.

    Lasya, Tibetan goddess of the moon and beauty who carries a mirror.

  8. #8
    Fellow Frogger! Lasya's Avatar
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    I've just checked my order, I bought 50 feet.
    Gillian and Chris

    74 D Special, and now a 74 Pallas 23 5 speed with air(maybe).

    Oh, and a Holden and a Suzuki.

    Lasya, Tibetan goddess of the moon and beauty who carries a mirror.

  9. #9
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    That should be more than sufficient, I used it on the engine side under the aluminium shield, managed to get two layers on and one behind the vinyl cabin firewall covering. You could use a sealer around the plate that goes over the steering wheel on engine side too!

  10. #10
    Tadpole
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    Hi , I have a 72 Safari & the main problem with the old girl is the heat transfer from engine to firewall etc ... I am going to use dyna mat inside & ceramic coat the exhaust as well as another heat shield product on the engine side of the fire wall ... Should fix it !
    Also the roof rack makes a lot of wind noise , anyone tried a deflector etc ? Cheers Tim

  11. #11
    Fellow Frogger! ScotFrog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim37 View Post
    Hi , I have a 72 Safari & the main problem with the old girl is the heat transfer from engine to firewall etc ... I am going to use dyna mat inside & ceramic coat the exhaust as well as another heat shield product on the engine side of the fire wall ... Should fix it !
    Also the roof rack makes a lot of wind noise , anyone tried a deflector etc ? Cheers Tim
    I had a Safari years ago and during a respray I took off the roof rack. When I assembled it I spent ages getting rid of the spiral winding of the grooved plastic sleeving. The wind whistle was unpleasant to say the least before I discovered how important the spiral winding is. Is yours wound on to the tubing so the plastic flutes form a spiral?

    Of course I responded to this thread before reading the other threads where this is covered in more detail by more knowledgable members. I wish I could remember to keep my mouth shut until really necessary.

    SF

  12. #12
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    Tadpole 602's Avatar
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    I stumbled across this closed-cell foil-backed product (1.35m wide x 33m roll, about 0.7mm thick) at Bunnings the other day
    Kingspan 1.35 x 33.33m AIR-CELL Permifloor I/N 0810204 | Bunnings Warehouse
    Is this a similar product to the USA insulation?
    --------
    Progress is fine, but it's gone on for too long.

  13. #13
    Fellow Frogger! Lasya's Avatar
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    Without looking directly at the product I can't say, but as the Harbour stuff is made for vehicles it has a high heat tolerance.
    Gillian and Chris

    74 D Special, and now a 74 Pallas 23 5 speed with air(maybe).

    Oh, and a Holden and a Suzuki.

    Lasya, Tibetan goddess of the moon and beauty who carries a mirror.

  14. #14
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim37 View Post
    Hi , I have a 72 Safari & the main problem with the old girl is the heat transfer from engine to firewall etc ... I am going to use dyna mat inside & ceramic coat the exhaust as well as another heat shield product on the engine side of the fire wall ... Should fix it !
    Also the roof rack makes a lot of wind noise , anyone tried a deflector etc ? Cheers Tim
    Dyna mat is a heavy sound suppression blanket. I foudn the tar based factory body deadener in the CX seemed to transmit more heat into the cabin more quickly that nothing at all ... ie: just a painted floor transferred less heat than the body deadener. I have no doubt it will be better at sound suppression than the insulation (it's heavy so will stop the panels drumming).

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    'Cit' homepage:
    Citroen Workshop
    Proper cars--
    '85 Series II CX2500 GTi Turbo I
    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/citro%EBn-forum/90325-best-project-car-you-have-ever-seen.html
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


    Modern Junk:
    '07 Poogoe 407 HDi 6spd manual

  15. #15
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 602 View Post
    I stumbled across this closed-cell foil-backed product (1.35m wide x 33m roll, about 0.7mm thick) at Bunnings the other day
    Kingspan 1.35 x 33.33m AIR-CELL Permifloor I/N 0810204 | Bunnings Warehouse
    Is this a similar product to the USA insulation?
    Looks similar... Expensive though! Is it burn tested? I'd be concerned about putting anythign that could be flamable under the bonnet of a car
    'Cit' homepage:
    Citroen Workshop
    Proper cars--
    '85 Series II CX2500 GTi Turbo I
    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/showthread.php?t=90325
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


    Modern Junk:
    '07 Poogoe 407 HDi 6spd manual

  16. #16
    Fellow Frogger! JAJEA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleChevron View Post
    Looks similar... Expensive though! Is it burn tested? I'd be concerned about putting anythign that could be flamable under the bonnet of a car
    It does say Shane - ""Add to Wish List"!
    Best regards, John

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    What a great response. Thanks to all who contributed. Looks like the dash has to come out. Got to be a first time for everything!

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    Fellow Frogger! Lasya's Avatar
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    I just did up to the bottom of the dash, taking the heater controls off was all. When it comes time to get behind the dash, then I will do it, but no burning need to do behind as what was done helps immensely.
    Gillian and Chris

    74 D Special, and now a 74 Pallas 23 5 speed with air(maybe).

    Oh, and a Holden and a Suzuki.

    Lasya, Tibetan goddess of the moon and beauty who carries a mirror.

  19. #19
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    I just covered the lower steering column with some insulating mat, plus installed a small section of tin to extend the manifold heat shield, yesterday. Thanks to PeterMol, Dave Rogers and others for the suggestion and assistance. I can already report a substantial lessening in heat soak through the column into the driver's well. Easy job, cheap and very effective. Now for the firewall etc!
    Lasya likes this.

  20. #20
    Fellow Frogger! Don B. Cilly's Avatar
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    I see how RHD becomes WHD (heat wise) on these cars

    I wonder how difficult it would have been to make a reversed cylinder head so you wouldn't have the steering column so close to the exhaust...

  21. #21
    Tadpole
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    Hi Roger,

    Quote Originally Posted by Roger Wilkinson View Post
    ... I had never thought of the steering column itself as a heat conductor. How much of the heat do you reckon is conducted by the steel tube of the steering column and how much goes up the inside of the tube?
    I'm surprised, too. The grey tube, from memory, seats in a shiny cup up at the steering-column end - but yes, there is a spring first, and perhaps if the spring is not prettty-much coil-bound it will let a fair bit of air pass.

    Quote Originally Posted by Roger Wilkinson View Post
    If most of it goes up the inside of the tube then you could make a less visible solution than wrapping the outside of the tube by cutting the tube and filling it with the insulation, then welding it back together. Just a thought.
    No need to cut the grey tube, surely? Just slide the steering wheel and its column into the car, pack the tube with a short sleeve of something suitable (I'd use a strip of black felt of a suitable thickness) and slide it all back together, no?

    Good thread, though!

    Best regards, Tony.

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