LHM leak troubleshooting
  • Register
  • Help
Page 1 of 2 12 Last
Results 1 to 25 of 28
Like Tree5Likes

Thread: LHM leak troubleshooting

  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! Big Frog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Somewhere near Mudgee, NSW
    Posts
    329

    Default LHM leak troubleshooting

    Hi All
    I have small leak / drip from my left rear suspension cylinder . I'm a bit time poor at present - so what's the best troubleshooting process to pursue ?
    I'm guessing it either the boot? or the cylinder seal?
    What are the steps to analysis?
    BF

    Advertisement

  2. #2
    Contented Peugeot Driver addo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Don't remind me!
    Posts
    16,609

    Default

    What model of CitroŽn?

  3. #3
    Fellow Frogger! Big Frog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Somewhere near Mudgee, NSW
    Posts
    329

    Default

    Oops
    69 ID
    BF
    addo likes this.

  4. #4
    1000+ Posts
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Faulconbridge
    Posts
    2,482

    Default

    Put it on high,hose it off,go round the block then have a look.

  5. #5
    UFO
    UFO is offline
    CitroŽn Tragic UFO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Gerringong, NSW, Australia
    Posts
    9,721

    Default

    More than likely a suspension boot.
    Craig K
    2009 C5 HDi Exclusive

  6. #6
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Symar/ca/usa
    Posts
    607

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Frog View Post
    Hi All
    I have small leak / drip from my left rear suspension cylinder . I'm a bit time poor at present - so what's the best troubleshooting process to pursue ?
    I'm guessing it either the boot? or the cylinder seal?
    What are the steps to analysis?
    BF
    Put the car in its upper suspension setting. With a flashlight look first at the sphere end of the cylinder - if wet there then it is the seal - not very likely though to be the problem Then look at the gator. Most likely you will see that it is wet on the bottom edge and possibly you will actually see the tear or rupture. It also may or may not be swollen with fluid.

    Suggestion - replace both sides along with the rear suspension seals and backing rings. The rear cylinders will 'leak' a lot more that the fronts due to the much lower pressures involved. The Teflon sealing rings are not all the great in sealing under these conditions.

    Steve

  7. #7
    Fellow Frogger! Big Frog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Somewhere near Mudgee, NSW
    Posts
    329

    Default

    OK - thanks , that's what I needed

  8. #8
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Symar/ca/usa
    Posts
    607

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Frog View Post
    OK - thanks , that's what I needed
    When doing the rear boots also check the rubber dust/grease cover(s) that protect the socket and ball for the end of the suspension push rod are good. Also a good idea to have a couple of replacement rod pins on hand just in case. Keep in mind that you have to turn the boot inside out (can be PITA if the rubber is cold) so the inner joint can be secured with Ligerex. When doing so make sure the alignment of the suspension rod and cylinder position with regards to the hydraulic line flange are correct. Quite hard to change once secured in place on the rod.

    Steve

  9. #9
    1000+ Posts forumnoreason's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Ici.
    Posts
    2,560

    Default

    With the boot and the rod how do you know where to position the rod in the cylinder to tighten inner ligarex to the boot and rod, also for front piston/rod/boot? i.e. Where on the rod do you tighten ligarex on?

  10. #10
    Administrator GreenBlood's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    8,184

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by forumnoreason View Post
    With the boot and the rod how do you know where to position the rod in the cylinder to tighten inner ligarex to the boot and rod, also for front piston/rod/boot? i.e. Where on the rod do you tighten ligarex on?
    It's been a while Steve but from memory there is knurling on the rear rod where you position the inner of the boot.

    For the front, the boot is fitted to the suspension cylinder at the top and the bell crank at the bottom. . .



    Cheers
    Chris
    74 D(very Special) >>Rejuvenation Thread<<
    08 C5 X7 HDi very Noir



    "Dťesse" Roland Barthes, 'Mythologies', 1957

    The Dťesse has all the characteristics of one of those objects fallen from another universe that fed the mania for novelty in the eighteenth century and a similar mania expressed by modern science fiction: the Dťesse is first and foremost the new Nautilus.

    (Umberto Eco [Ed], The History of Beauty, Rizzoli, NY, 2004)

  11. #11
    mnm
    mnm is offline
    Croak croak... mnm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    3,227

    Default

    Here is a link to a post I made about this procedure a few years ago... not that detailed but they might help. Yes, Chris is correct, there is knurling on the rod where the boot is ligarexed.

    DS Invagination

    Matthew

  12. #12
    1000+ Posts forumnoreason's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Ici.
    Posts
    2,560

    Default

    Good oh thanks guys, there you go BF if you get stuck. Just had a look at the replacement boots I bought from some mob in the States… I had one sitting on the cylinder, this job was coming up very shortly but just discovered the boot is *^%$! where it goes on the rod. SPLIT.
    So much for the claim better production than original. never even got to use it. Unbelievable. Aholes. Original pieces to be ordered. God this gives me the *^%$!
    It also shows these things need to be stored very carefully and even more importantly the car used other than sitting. A sitting D is a dead D!

  13. #13
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Symar/ca/usa
    Posts
    607

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by forumnoreason View Post
    Good oh thanks guys, there you go BF if you get stuck. Just had a look at the replacement boots I bought from some mob in the States… I had one sitting on the cylinder, this job was coming up very shortly but just discovered the boot is *^%$! where it goes on the rod. SPLIT.
    So much for the claim better production than original. never even got to use it. Unbelievable. Aholes. Original pieces to be ordered. God this gives me the *^%$!
    It also shows these things need to be stored very carefully and even more importantly the car used other than sitting. A sitting D is a dead D!
    Unless you are really lucky you will not find any original boots anymore - and even it you did they are so old at this point to be basically useless. The problem of the damn things splitting on installation happened with the OEM units also. All too aware of this as I have owned and driven D's exclusively for over 50 years and have done this job more than just a few times . What really, really helps in all of this is to heat the rubber boot up to around 120 degrees F (about 50C) just prior to working with it. Makes inverting it and working with it a lot easier and greatly reduces the risk of damage.

    When you attach the boot to the push rod you want the fluid return nipple to be about 35 degrees to either the right or left of 0 or 12 o'clock (depending on the side of the car) when the rod's securing hole (where the pin is pushed through) lines up the the hole in the suspension arm/ball socket (parallel with the ground).

    The first time you have to do this job you begin to wonder if removing the engine would not be easier . After a couple of times it becomes almost 'duck soup'.

    Steve
    UFO and forumnoreason like this.

  14. #14
    1000+ Posts daffyduck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA USA
    Posts
    1,955

    Default

    Hate to disappoint you but new, Citroen boots are readily available. They cost more than the aftermarket ones but they also last 15 years or more. And they never need glue. Very good quality.

    Doing the Daffyduck dance via the AussieFrogs app. With a cane! gimp quack quack ow ow ow.

  15. #15
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Symar/ca/usa
    Posts
    607

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by daffyduck View Post
    Hate to disappoint you but new, Citroen boots are readily available. They cost more than the aftermarket ones but they also last 15 years or more. And they never need glue. Very good quality.

    Doing the Daffyduck dance via the AussieFrogs app. With a cane! gimp quack quack ow ow ow.


    Walt,

    Aftermarket or OEM the service life of those rear boots is between 3 to 5 years if the cars are used at all. And that has been the case with all of LHM compatible boots, OEM or not. Has to to do with exposure to the elements and the rubber used. The front boots last a lot longer as they are protected by the dust shield. At this point in time and space I doubt seriously if the 'OEM' units are made by the factory. FWIW I have had excellent results with the aftermarket units that Dave Brownhill in England has been supplying.

    I forgot to add that the level of Ozone in the air has a lot to do with how fast the rear LHM compatible boots deteriorate. In areas of low Ozone and on cars that are not used much they may well last much longer than 5 or so years. OTOH in areas of high Ozone, Los Angeles and surrounding areas for example, even 5 years can be a real stretch if the car(s) are used on a regular basis.

    Steve
    Last edited by Citroenfan; 23rd June 2014 at 03:11 PM.

  16. #16
    1000+ Posts daffyduck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA USA
    Posts
    1,955

    Default

    Real Citroen boots are readily available. I have one car that is used regularly and the boots have been on the car since 1999. And that car has spent all its time in the ozone covering tens of thousands of miles. Aftermarket boots are cheaper to purchase but they don't last as long and once in a while you get a brand new one with a pinhole. The real parts are a good value in the grand scheme of things.

    And the name is Darrin.






    Doing the Daffy Duck dance with the AussieFrogs app and a cane.

  17. #17
    1000+ Posts forumnoreason's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Ici.
    Posts
    2,560

    Default

    The main man in Holland, Citroen Andre, is supplying OEM rear and Franzose supplied me with OEM fronts recently, they're a good option BF if you discover you're in need, although local dudes are a good option too.

  18. #18
    Fellow Frogger
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    9,774

    Default

    Surely Citroen would have bought in their rubber parts like most manufacturers would? The rear boots are available as a Citroen part in current packaging, but do cost more. The front boots do not appear to be available from Citroen, although Franzose has some kind of better quality front boot on offer now. It wasn't clear whether or not it was an OEM item when I last looked. The rubber rings that sit under the Ligarex and the small boot for the ball seat at the back are all repro items unless you can find NOS somewhere. The rings can often be reused. We have had another discussion on this issue last month with a variety of owners finding repro rubber is not lasting at all well in many cases and can sometimes begin to disintegrate even in storage.

  19. #19
    1000+ Posts forumnoreason's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Ici.
    Posts
    2,560

    Default

    Rubber grease might stave degredation off, I'm going to give the boots a lick of it when I get them on, in fact any rubber I see is getting it!

  20. #20
    UFO
    UFO is offline
    CitroŽn Tragic UFO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Gerringong, NSW, Australia
    Posts
    9,721

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by forumnoreason View Post
    Rubber grease might stave degredation off, I'm going to give the boots a lick of it when I get them on, in fact any rubber I see is getting it!
    That could be a passion killer.
    ScotFrog likes this.
    Craig K
    2009 C5 HDi Exclusive

  21. #21
    Contented Peugeot Driver addo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Don't remind me!
    Posts
    16,609

    Default

    Clearly you haven't seen Steven with a tube of rubber grease in his hand, and that look in his eye!

  22. #22
    UFO
    UFO is offline
    CitroŽn Tragic UFO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Gerringong, NSW, Australia
    Posts
    9,721

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by addo View Post
    Clearly you haven't seen Steven with a tube of rubber grease in his hand, and that look in his eye!
    You're telling the story so far addo.
    Craig K
    2009 C5 HDi Exclusive

  23. #23
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Symar/ca/usa
    Posts
    607

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by David S View Post
    Surely Citroen would have bought in their rubber parts like most manufacturers would? The rear boots are available as a Citroen part in current packaging, but do cost more. The front boots do not appear to be available from Citroen, although Franzose has some kind of better quality front boot on offer now. It wasn't clear whether or not it was an OEM item when I last looked. The rubber rings that sit under the Ligarex and the small boot for the ball seat at the back are all repro items unless you can find NOS somewhere. The rings can often be reused. We have had another discussion on this issue last month with a variety of owners finding repro rubber is not lasting at all well in many cases and can sometimes begin to disintegrate even in storage.

    Keep in mind that with rear boots the factory used a cloth strip to protect the rubber boot on the inside lip where it was ligerex to the push rod. When putting on the replacement boot(s) one should do the same

    AFAIK most all of the aftermarket rubber goods of decent quality are from Parts Industries. There may be others. And it is quite in the realm of possibility that Parts Industries has two different pricing levels for the parts. Some years back (15 to 20 and more) and I have no idea where they came from, we got rubber goods for the cars here (USA) that, when good, were crap. The Cit marked items were just a bit better quality crap. Over the years (50+) I have had OEM rubber last and/or fail at about the same rate as the decent aftermarket units.

    As to the rear boots that came from the US mentioned in a previous post. Not sure where they would have came from as the only person I can think of off hand would have been Don James and he has been retired for some time now. A lot of his stuff was of excellent quality though that could vary a lot. Getting rubber compounded to a specific quality level and/or use target can be a bit of a crap shoot. And molding rubber into complex shapes that have to flex and be subjected to high pressures is an art in and of itself. And when it comes to rubber compounding lets not fall into the trap thinking that Citroen had all of the answers. Just recall the unmitigated disaster with the sphere diaphragms back in the early 70's.

    Steve

  24. #24
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Symar/ca/usa
    Posts
    607

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by David S View Post
    Surely Citroen would have bought in their rubber parts like most manufacturers would? The rear boots are available as a Citroen part in current packaging, but do cost more. The front boots do not appear to be available from Citroen, although Franzose has some kind of better quality front boot on offer now. It wasn't clear whether or not it was an OEM item when I last looked. The rubber rings that sit under the Ligarex and the small boot for the ball seat at the back are all repro items unless you can find NOS somewhere. The rings can often be reused. We have had another discussion on this issue last month with a variety of owners finding repro rubber is not lasting at all well in many cases and can sometimes begin to disintegrate even in storage.
    While I have no concrete evidence I do think it a decent assumption that the rubber parts for the D's were most likely made by Michelin - at least from the start as rubber compounding and molding were their area of expertise. Quite possible that at some point a hotshot sales team from another supplier convinced management they could do a better job at a cheaper price . The hydraulic fluids were a similar case. Cit just gave Total (and others) a set of specifications they needed and let them do the actual formulation. In the case of LHM they just used the base stock for the MilSpec hydraulic fluid as the starting point.

    Steve

  25. #25
    Fellow Frogger!
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Symar/ca/usa
    Posts
    607

    Default

    I understand that Andre Pol has rear suspension boots in Citroen bags if one wants OEM units.

    Steve

Page 1 of 2 12 Last

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •