tachometric relay plug
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  1. #1
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Default tachometric relay plug

    Hi guys,

    has anyone ever found the tachometric relay plug for sale ... Refered to as "big blue" as used on countless injected cars from the 80's ....

    Advertisement


    this would be the relay itself.

    Genune Peugeot 205 1.6 1.9 gti Tachometric Fuel Pump Relay Rally | eBay

    or for the same thing with "ferrari" in the name you can pay this

    FERRARI TESTAROSSA NEW IN BOX TACHOMETRIC RELAY 124717 TACHOMETER | eBay

    I'm looking for the electrical connector you plug to the bottom. I think even commonbores from the 80's had this relay.

    seeya,
    Shane L.
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    UFO
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    Yes. I think I had a thread about it some years ago but hopefully post the big crash. I may even have pics of it. It is a BOSCH replacement that I got from GSF and it was black. Look for Peugeot 205. I'll go searching for pics and report back later. IIRC it cost me about $60 landed. Plugged in and worked instantly.
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    UFO
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    Attached is a PDF I have from somewhere. Not sure where, but it has some useful information. Also some edited text between Sergio at GSF and I way back in 2009. NOTE that the email is in reverse order of course.



    Sergio

    I have checked against the Bosch catalogue page D59 and it shows the quoted part number which also matches what remains of what I can read on the old relay. So I suspect that the information I have is correct.


    Bosch in Australia | Bosch Australia


    Craig




    From: Sergio Nero <[email protected]>

    Dear Sir
    Many thanks for your order , however the Bosch number that you have supplied in the comments section comes up as a fuel pump relay for 205 GTI so i am a little confused , Perhaps you could shed some light on it .

    Regards
    Sergio Nero
    Export and Specialist Manager.






    Online Order

    Online Order Number - W76486471310
    Part Number Description Detail Price Quantity Total
    N92354 IGNITION MODULE CX ALL 7PIN
    34.50
    1
    34.50
    Sub-Total(exc.VAT + Delivery)
    Delivery (exc.VAT)
    0.00
    Total(exc.VAT)
    VAT
    Total
    34.50
    Export Customer - Must be contacted with Export Delivery Price by Preferred Contact method given below
    Export Customer outside EC - Must not be Charged VAT
    Customer Details

    Vehicle Details
    Vehicle Make: Citroen
    Vehicle Model: CX 2500 ie Auto
    Year:
    1985

    Comments: The part I seek is the "big blue" tachometric relay for a CX2500ie. If this is the correct part please supply. If not, do not supply. Bosch equivalent part numbe is 0 280 230 009 I expect freight will be less than 20UKP. If so please ship immediately - no further confirmation required.
    Attached Files Attached Files
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  4. #4
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Hi UFO,

    yes, the relay itself is readily available from your local auto-electrician... It's the plug that plugs onto the bottom of it that I'm after. My father bought one years ago and was told they are used on heaps of cars including commonbores

    seeya,
    Shane L.
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  5. #5
    Contented Peugeot Driver addo's Avatar
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    Seen that on '90s Volvos, I think.

    But - why not go to the last incarnation, with the red push/pull tab on a black plug, and a black relay?

  6. #6
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by addo View Post
    Seen that on '90s Volvos, I think.

    But - why not go to the last incarnation, with the red push/pull tab on a black plug, and a black relay?
    the wiring is just pushing out of the back of the connector housing on the CX, so I'm just chasing the new connector, otherwise once every blue moon I need to go fiddle with the relay to get the car running again.....

    seeya,
    Shane L.
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    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


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  7. #7
    UFO
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleChevron View Post
    Hi UFO,

    yes, the relay itself is readily available from your local auto-electrician... It's the plug that plugs onto the bottom of it that I'm after. My father bought one years ago and was told they are used on heaps of cars including commonbores

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    Well I'd suggest that you would find them in lots of places as the relays were used on GMH JD Camira, VK
    Commodore, Ford XE Falcon, BMW, Citroen, Volvo, Peugeot.
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  8. #8
    Fellow Frogger! denxm's Avatar
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    i needed one for my bx and searching the wreckers ,found a camira and one type of commodore had the same,
    if you need the wires-plug,hopefully you can come up with the goods by checking wreckers yards for same.

  9. #9
    UFO
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    Quote Originally Posted by denxm View Post
    i needed one for my bx and searching the wreckers ,found a camira and one type of commodore had the same,
    if you need the wires-plug,hopefully you can come up with the goods by checking wreckers yards for same.
    Remarkable!

    And well done you!
    Last edited by UFO; 27th December 2013 at 01:32 AM.
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    Call Ian @ Grevilles in Ballarat-Great guy -always helpful-will probably have one in stock.

    That is your Xmas gift sorted!

  11. #11
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    tachometric relay plug-p1160824.jpegtachometric relay plug-p1160825.jpgtachometric relay plug-p1160826.jpegtachometric relay plug-p1160827.jpegtachometric relay plug-p1160828.jpegtachometric relay plug-p1160830.jpgtachometric relay plug-p1160831.jpeg
    Quote Originally Posted by pekay49 View Post
    Call Ian @ Grevilles in Ballarat-Great guy -always helpful-will probably have one in stock.

    That is your Xmas gift sorted!
    That's where I usually go... Nah, no luck there.

    I'll find one eventually ..... While I've got the radiator/condeser/fans out, and there's all this room there. I thought i'd have a closer look at big blue.

    There was 4 wires that would push back into the housing rather than plug onto the relay.



    I filled the back of the housing with 2part resin... It actually appears to have worked until I can chase another up. I can plug the relay on/off as much as I like and the wires are all locked solid within the housing .... nothing pushes back.



    The biggest issues were the tiny spade terminals (signal wires) were ones that would fall out. Given the relay is hidden down where you can't see it .... you were never sure if it was ok.



    It should no longer be intermittant ... unless of course there is a problem somewhere else



    Years ago when I replaced quite a few of the connector blocks under the bonnet I went about it the wrong way. I spent a couple of hours solding/making up these. What I did last time was try to snip just the connector off, then solder and heat shrink the new spade terminal on for the new connectors. This didn't work out well at all. It made the wire to "fat" to fit properly into the housings. It also left the last bit of the existing wire there, that likely won't be sound. Using the pre-made connectors above, I'll snip back into the wiring harness a couple of inches, and solder the new connectors in.



    This is the connector down to the knock sensor. ... I'll have to snip it off and replace with standard spade terminals.






    These are the last attempt. You can see the wiring is all bunched up... and it does't I think some of it's still intermittent as the connectors are very hard to plug together.

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    'Cit' homepage:
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    Proper cars--
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    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/showthread.php?t=90325
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    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

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  12. #12
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleChevron View Post
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    That's where I usually go... Nah, no luck there.

    I'll find one eventually ..... While I've got the radiator/condeser/fans out, and there's all this room there. I thought i'd have a closer look at big blue.

    There was 4 wires that would push back into the housing rather than plug onto the relay.



    I filled the back of the housing with 2part resin... It actually appears to have worked until I can chase another up. I can plug the relay on/off as much as I like and the wires are all locked solid within the housing .... nothing pushes back.



    The biggest issues were the tiny spade terminals (signal wires) were ones that would fall out. Given the relay is hidden down where you can't see it .... you were never sure if it was ok.



    It should no longer be intermittant ... unless of course there is a problem somewhere else



    Years ago when I replaced quite a few of the connector blocks under the bonnet I went about it the wrong way. I spent a couple of hours solding/making up these. What I did last time was try to snip just the connector off, then solder and heat shrink the new spade terminal on for the new connectors. This didn't work out well at all. It made the wire to "fat" to fit properly into the housings. It also left the last bit of the existing wire there, that likely won't be sound. Using the pre-made connectors above, I'll snip back into the wiring harness a couple of inches, and solder the new connectors in.



    This is the connector down to the knock sensor. ... I'll have to snip it off and replace with standard spade terminals.






    These are the last attempt. You can see the wiring is all bunched up... and it does't I think some of it's still intermittent as the connectors are very hard to plug together.

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    Well installing new wiring connectors is going well... I figure it would take maybe 2hours to snip out the existing connectors and solder in the newies....

    I unplug the "3wire" connector block beside the air horns that has little bullet like connectors in it.... Hmm, one of the wires drops out of the back of the housing ... It mustn't have been crimped tightly enough at the factory nearly 3decades ago. So I figure it's as good a place to start as any and snip the wire back an inch down the wire and strip it to reveal .... traces of copper rot .... sigh.... So I unwrap another 20cm of harness and find ............. slightly worse copper rot ... Ok, out with the battery, as I snip the wire off 10cm length after 10cm length ... the copper rot getting *worse* the further I unwrap the haness .... ARRRrrrhhhh... I end up unwindinding the harness all the way down to the battery, the upto the AEI computer plugs ..... sigh. Pull the plug off, extract the pin from the computer plug .. the wire is rotten the entire length. So I solder a new wire to the computer pin and and run it all the way back to the plug at the air horns.

    Ok some wire, other side of the plug, snip it off an inch back .................... black wire ... rotten... You gotta be bloody kidding me. I unwind that harness half the width of the engine bay before I find nice shiny new copper I can solder too.... That's 2hours down and exactly "1 wire" of "1 connector" block done................ Looks like I've found myself a new "bloody huge" task. If that wire to the AEI computer was no good.... No doubts what the rest of them will be like

    Bloody salty soggy pommy cars .... It's been in this country for 18years.... and I'm still chasing issues that date back to it driving salty soggy roads for the first 10years of it's life! No wonder it's not been starting reliablly ... given the wiring to the computers must be full of rot/resistance and dodgy connections.

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    'Cit' homepage:
    Citroen Workshop
    Proper cars--
    '85 Series II CX2500 GTi Turbo I
    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/showthread.php?t=90325
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

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  13. #13
    Now go make me a sandwich Hotrodelectric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleChevron View Post
    Well installing new wiring connectors is going well... I figure it would take maybe 2hours to snip out the existing connectors and solder in the newies....

    I unplug the "3wire" connector block beside the air horns that has little bullet like connectors in it.... Hmm, one of the wires drops out of the back of the housing ... It mustn't have been crimped tightly enough at the factory nearly 3decades ago. So I figure it's as good a place to start as any and snip the wire back an inch down the wire and strip it to reveal .... traces of copper rot .... sigh.... So I unwrap another 20cm of harness and find ............. slightly worse copper rot ... Ok, out with the battery, as I snip the wire off 10cm length after 10cm length ... the copper rot getting *worse* the further I unwrap the haness .... ARRRrrrhhhh... I end up unwindinding the harness all the way down to the battery, the upto the AEI computer plugs ..... sigh. Pull the plug off, extract the pin from the computer plug .. the wire is rotten the entire length. So I solder a new wire to the computer pin and and run it all the way back to the plug at the air horns.

    Ok some wire, other side of the plug, snip it off an inch back .................... black wire ... rotten... You gotta be bloody kidding me. I unwind that harness half the width of the engine bay before I find nice shiny new copper I can solder too.... That's 2hours down and exactly "1 wire" of "1 connector" block done................ Looks like I've found myself a new "bloody huge" task. If that wire to the AEI computer was no good.... No doubts what the rest of them will be like

    Bloody salty soggy pommy cars .... It's been in this country for 18years.... and I'm still chasing issues that date back to it driving salty soggy roads for the first 10years of it's life! No wonder it's not been starting reliablly ... given the wiring to the computers must be full of rot/resistance and dodgy connections.

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    I'm not saying anything.
    The measure of your character isn't what you do when people are watching- it's what you do when they aren't watching.

  14. #14
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hotrodelectric View Post
    I'm not saying anything.
    You'd just fit a whole new wiring harness right I wonder if I can buy new crimp on terminals for the computer plugs I'll have to find that UK online auto connector shop again.
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    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

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  15. #15
    Now go make me a sandwich Hotrodelectric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleChevron View Post
    You'd just fit a whole new wiring harness right I wonder if I can buy new crimp on terminals for the computer plugs I'll have to find that UK online auto connector shop again.
    Trust me Shane, you have no idea how many times I've been through your problem. I just wanted to tweak you a little

    As for the terminals, you should be able to pick them up at a BMW or a Porsche dealer. Really just about any German car dealer or Bosch specialist. They'll be a little on the expensive side, but shipping won't be quite the hassle. I think you can also try an EFI shop, or a Nissan Z-Car parts shop. Take a sample with you so they can match it up. Almost any Bosch K-Jet car will have the plug- Volvo, Peugeot, and so on.

    Now that I'm thinking about it, fitting a complete new harness isn't a bad idea....
    The measure of your character isn't what you do when people are watching- it's what you do when they aren't watching.

  16. #16
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    The solution I've used to sort odd ball connectors fitted to tacho relays, wiper controllers, et al is solder a 100mm wire tail directly to the relay pins, heat shrink and fit a multi pole molex male plug to the other end.

    Then fit the matching female to the wiring harness.

    Problem solved for ever and with parts which are on hand.

    Only down side is the replacement, if required, needs to modified. Also originality for those who put aesthetics ahead of reliability.

  17. #17
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    I don't think wire rot is restricted to ex-UK cars. Plenty of local cars have it too.
    Citroen Service has a catalogue of connectors etc., so you may find the parts there. However, I'd expect Wurth, RS or Farnell (Now Element 14) would be better options.
    I thought I had a good connector for that injection relay somewhere. Do you still want to replace it?

  18. #18
    Now go make me a sandwich Hotrodelectric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robmac View Post
    The solution I've used to sort odd ball connectors fitted to tacho relays, wiper controllers, et al is solder a 100mm wire tail directly to the relay pins, heat shrink and fit a multi pole molex male plug to the other end.

    Then fit the matching female to the wiring harness.

    Problem solved for ever and with parts which are on hand.

    Only down side is the replacement, if required, needs to modified. Also originality for those who put aesthetics ahead of reliability.
    The idea is a great one. I've seen it done numerous times from one-off accessory installs to complete systems. Done well, I have zero quibble with it at all.

    Where I need a basic plug, Molex is the go-to choice. I've spent a lot of money with Molex over the years.

    I think that's where one of my biggest downfalls lie. I worry entirely too much about the replaceability/serviceability aspect. I'll spend one hell of a lot of time looking for the 'correct' plug and rejoice when I find just the correct terminals.

    I'd probably take Shane's CX on just for giggles.

    However, I'd expect Wurth, RS or Farnell (Now Element 14) would be better options.
    You posted as I was finishing. Wurth would be an excellent look-in.
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    Shane,

    For the few odd relays like the blue one and the knock sensor, is there a good reason against just soldering to the relay? I know you can't disconnect except with wire snips. I know it's a bodge, but...
    JohnW

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  20. #20
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David S View Post
    I don't think wire rot is restricted to ex-UK cars. Plenty of local cars have it too.
    Citroen Service has a catalogue of connectors etc., so you may find the parts there. However, I'd expect Wurth, RS or Farnell (Now Element 14) would be better options.
    I thought I had a good connector for that injection relay somewhere. Do you still want to replace it?
    Thanks David,

    keep the connector, it's probably used on your XM's !!! I'm sure I'll find one at the local wreckers if I ever get there!

    seeya,
    shane L.
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    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/showthread.php?t=90325
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


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  21. #21
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnW View Post
    Shane,

    For the few odd relays like the blue one and the knock sensor, is there a good reason against just soldering to the relay? I know you can't disconnect except with wire snips. I know it's a bodge, but...
    The tachometric relay is known for being "suspect". I don't want to solder to it as it limits your ability to swap it if your ever stuck somewhere and need to change it You know all the connectors I'm replacing would likely be sensible to just "join".... and remove the connectors completelly. No doubt they are the just to make assembly easier!

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    'Cit' homepage:
    Citroen Workshop
    Proper cars--
    '85 Series II CX2500 GTi Turbo I
    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/showthread.php?t=90325
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


    Modern Junk:
    '07 Poogoe 407 HDi 6spd manual

  22. #22
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    This is the fun mess I'm looking at As you can see I haven't even been able to start the car to get it off the jack yet... I can't wait to see what it drives like with a nice tight front end.

    tachometric relay plug-p1160834.jpgtachometric relay plug-p1160851.jpgtachometric relay plug-p1160850.jpgtachometric relay plug-p1160849.jpgtachometric relay plug-p1160848.jpgtachometric relay plug-p1160847.jpegtachometric relay plug-p1160846.jpgtachometric relay plug-p1160841.jpegtachometric relay plug-p1160840.jpegtachometric relay plug-p1160838.jpegtachometric relay plug-p1160836.jpgtachometric relay plug-p1160835.jpegtachometric relay plug-p1160852.jpg
    'Cit' homepage:
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    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


    Modern Junk:
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  23. #23
    Too many posts! JohnW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleChevron View Post
    The tachometric relay is known for being "suspect". I don't want to solder to it as it limits your ability to swap it if your ever stuck somewhere and need to change it You know all the connectors I'm replacing would likely be sensible to just "join".... and remove the connectors completelly. No doubt they are the just to make assembly easier!

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    Yeah, I thought the same really. Ah well, solder individual connectors and at least get it moving while a plug is procured.

    Saw your recent wiring photos too! Wow.....
    JohnW

    Renault 4CV 1951
    Renault R8 1965
    Renault Scenic 2005 (wife's)
    Renault Scenic 2007 (mine)
    Renault Scenic 2006 (daughter's)
    CitroŽn CX Pallas 1980

    National Co-ordinator, Renault 4CV Register of Australia

  24. #24
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    tachometric relay plug-p1160853.jpegtachometric relay plug-p1160861.jpgtachometric relay plug-p1160860.jpgtachometric relay plug-p1160859.jpgtachometric relay plug-p1160858.jpegtachometric relay plug-p1160857.jpegtachometric relay plug-p1160856.jpgtachometric relay plug-p1160855.jpgtachometric relay plug-p1160854.jpgtachometric relay plug-p1160862.jpeg



    Surpringly the rest of the wiring was ok, other than that one first wire I did. The was some rot in another wire over near the header tank ............. I traced it back and found two bloody crimp on joiners in the harness...... Gee's bloody Citroen was still doing that in the mid 80's Whenever I find that in ID/DS harnesses is mean rotten wiring around the crimps and shitty connections... This one was no different.







    Bloody mess to try and re-bind.



    Wow, look how many warning lights work now



    It looks like I have an oil temperature gauge again.

    I'd forgotten the globes were out for the speedo ... bloody annoying that. It should only take 5minut
    es to fix that ....









    WTF ?? For the life of me I couldn't see where the speedo globes were ... buried ... This would drive you insane. I've ended up with it in a million bits..... It so annoying as I've been here in the past.... I just can't remember, though I can still see all the labels I put on the plugs. See that last piccie, the clear plastic funnels the light down from a globe that is clearly visible without pulling it all apart ....................... Sigh ................. I guess I'll check and clean all the ribbon circuit as I assemble it. Maybe the oil pressure gauge will decide to start working again then too

    seeya
    Shane L.
    'Cit' homepage:
    Citroen Workshop
    Proper cars--
    '85 Series II CX2500 GTi Turbo I
    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/showthread.php?t=90325
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


    Modern Junk:
    '07 Poogoe 407 HDi 6spd manual

  25. #25
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Well the LED instrument globes have arrived .... So I replaced all the blown globes in the instrument panel........... To find I now have no tacho. Interestingly enough, it's not just no tacho.... the sucker is completely dead, it doesn't move around in unison with indicators/etc..... I'm figuring it's the tacho itself rather than wiring out under the bonnet........... This should be fun right? How do I test a tachometer

    I guess I start by replacing the 30 year old capacitors on the tacho and oil level meter board and go from there. Given the tacho needle used to bounce so much I figure the filtering caps are dead for starters.

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    'Cit' homepage:
    Citroen Workshop
    Proper cars--
    '85 Series II CX2500 GTi Turbo I
    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/showthread.php?t=90325
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


    Modern Junk:
    '07 Poogoe 407 HDi 6spd manual

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