DS 23 Side Mirror Mounting Problem
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Thread: DS 23 Side Mirror Mounting Problem

  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! JAJEA's Avatar
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    Default DS 23 Side Mirror Mounting Problem

    Attachment 45548

    Anybody know to pull these apart apart without reverting to the sledge hammer?

    Every time we met an oncoming truck on the trip to Melbourne on the Newell Highway recently the RH side mirror got slammed against the door! Gave us a hell of a fright the first time.

    So, one of the first things tackled after the hassles of a RWC was the side mirrors. New trim from Retrospect Parts obtained and installed using the new convex glass mirrors supplied with the kit. I was not too happy with the result because the new trim does not "sit" snuggly on the glass. Single photo below shows the non uniform contact of trim to glass.

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    I DS 23 Side Mirror Mounting Problem-img_4091.jpg DS 23 Side Mirror Mounting Problem-img_4082.jpg
    Body of the Cipa is nice and flat, that is, it is in the one plane.

    With the new convex glass being "curved", the trim mounting onto the flat Cipa body can not be brought together along the entire perimeter of the mounting.

    So be it. I have live with it. I considered reinstating the original mirror but with gaining the added vision and the original 40 year old mirror being worse for wear; I'll put up with it not being perfect.

    So with the mirrors fixed, I turned to tackle the removal of the arms (yes 2 different lengths left and right) from the door mounting fixture. With the mirror smashing against the door saga, the first thing I tried to do when we got home was to tighten it up but I could not get it to budge so I've have been saturating it with penetrene for a while for when the occasion came for removal.

    All to no avail. I can not free it as the nice round captive screw rotates with the slotted nut top fixing.

    I hope that I have not wasted money and time on the new Retrospec trims and I need to source replacement mirrors.

    Anybody had similar trouble but manage to sort it out?

    Greatly appreciate some advice.

    JAJEA

    [Reminded me of the Thread not too long ago re "looking for a good honest mechanics" not charging the earth. A good honest mechanic would have to say - "get 2 new ones John!" Before I do, can anybody help?]

    DS 23 Side Mirror Mounting Problem-img_4087.jpg

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    Your first photo didn't show what you have but some cars have the arm fitted to a heavy plated base, but most are the stalk type, secured by a nut on the inside top edge of the door skin. Assuming it's the last type, there are at least two different types of arm joint. One has just a large headed screw going into a blind hole. The other has what looks like a screw with a mate at the other side without a slot, but it's actually a slotted nut screwing onto a round headed bolt with a flat half way up to stop it turning. If it's turning, then it's not meant to and you mat have to drill it out to replace it. I think I'd try to save the slotted nut and sacrifice the bolt and then try to replace it using something stainless and files round. What actually stops them flailing about is a soft plastic washer and it may be that the bolt is shouldered, so further attempts to tighten it may be pointless once the washer is worn.

    I'm not entirely sure, but if you actually meant the pivot for the mirror itself, one type has an exposed screw and the other is only accessible with the mirror removed. There will be a hidden cup and spring for tension.

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    Quote Originally Posted by David S View Post
    Your first photo didn't show what you have but some cars have the arm fitted to a heavy plated base, but most are the stalk type, secured by a nut on the inside top edge of the door skin. Assuming it's the last type, there are at least two different types of arm joint. One has just a large headed screw going into a blind hole. The other has what looks like a screw with a mate at the other side without a slot, but it's actually a slotted nut screwing onto a round headed bolt with a flat half way up to stop it turning. If it's turning, then it's not meant to and you mat have to drill it out to replace it. I think I'd try to save the slotted nut and sacrifice the bolt and then try to replace it using something stainless and files round. What actually stops them flailing about is a soft plastic washer and it may be that the bolt is shouldered, so further attempts to tighten it may be pointless once the washer is worn.

    I'm not entirely sure, but if you actually meant the pivot for the mirror itself, one type has an exposed screw and the other is only accessible with the mirror removed. There will be a hidden cup and spring for tension.
    Thank you David.

    Not sure what happened but the Attachment 45548 is a closeup photo of the item in question - nothing to do with the actual mirror pivot to the arm.

    DS 23 Side Mirror Mounting Problem-img_4096.jpg

    Nevertheless one of the"arrangements" you have assumed is correct - the slotted nut and the round headed bolt holding the arm to the body fixture.

    I pondered as to how it must it work and you have confirmed that the round headed bolt should not must not turn otherwise there is no way of tightening it.

    I felt that the slotted nut should have been underneath the fixture and not on top exposed to the weather and rust - it is certainly rusted solid.

    And, thank you, the round bolt will have to be sacrificed.

    If anybody has such side mirror(s) that is unserviceable that may have the bolts to spare, I would be more than happy to buy.

    Two of required.

    John

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    UFO
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    Well I hate to tell you, but I bought two new mirrors for my D some years ago after I had stripped the bolts trying to tigthen the arms in a failed attempt to stop foldback. However a few years ago the crappy plastic surround on the mirrors succumbed to Aussie sunshine so I bought the replacement kits from Retrospec and fitted them - a sometimes tricky task. As per their advice I did not cut the supplied silicone trim (not saying that you did) but I did have to gently prise the frame out just a little and at that point the mirror and surround just popped in and has been secure ever since. The ends meet perfectly.

    Did your mirrors go in really easy or was it a challenge? If easy then perhaps your frames are slightly wider for whatever reason. Maybe flexing the sides back in and refitting.

    I hope you can find a way to resolve the bolt situation and as David suggested you need a nylon washer in between the base and the arm. I keep a 10c piece in the ashtray for the purpose of tightening the bolt/nut every now and then.
    Craig K
    2009 C5 HDi Exclusive

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    Quote Originally Posted by UFO View Post
    Well I hate to tell you, but I bought two new mirrors for my D some years ago after I had stripped the bolts trying to tigthen the arms in a failed attempt to stop foldback. However a few years ago the crappy plastic surround on the mirrors succumbed to Aussie sunshine so I bought the replacement kits from Retrospec and fitted them - a sometimes tricky task. As per their advice I did not cut the supplied silicone trim (not saying that you did) but I did have to gently prise the frame out just a little and at that point the mirror and surround just popped in and has been secure ever since. The ends meet perfectly.

    Did your mirrors go in really easy or was it a challenge? If easy then perhaps your frames are slightly wider for whatever reason. Maybe flexing the sides back in and refitting.

    I hope you can find a way to resolve the bolt situation and as David suggested you need a nylon washer in between the base and the arm. I keep a 10c piece in the ashtray for the purpose of tightening the bolt/nut every now and then.

    I managed to "free" one but at the expence of the round head bolt - penetrene eventually worked but threads on bolt corroded to almost nothing and whilst the flat of the bolt worked to stop its rotation, with the corrosion and partial twisting it is unserviceable.

    The other one is the drivers one that had to be constantly pushed back with each on coming truck and that could not be tightened. Notwithstanding the corrosion, the arm no longer has the "flat" hole to stop the round bolt from rotating - it has to be, sort of destroyed in order to fix as it is useless as is. If I can save the slotted nuts (and rechrome in due course) and determine thread size/pitch I'll find a bolt to suit for the time being before I consider new ones.

    As for the new trim to the mirrors, I had a s#*t of a time with the first one and declared it impossible.

    So, I went to Retrospecparts' web site to view the installation video; It looked so easy as to the difficulty I was experiencing; so back to the instructions.

    Step 4, which I took little notice at the first read is quite clear, you need a clearence of 1.5 to 2.0 mm between glass and Cipa body. I had close to zero at some spots that I was tryng to squeeze the trim in - no wonder I was having trouble. So, with a bit of "panel beating" to the Cipa body, I obtained the required clearences and relatively easily completed the task.

    I did not at any stage felt that the trim was too long because of the initial difficulty, I was trying to "stretch" the trim in order to reduce its thickness, so, with the second attempt after getting the clearences right, I again was working on two fronts, constantly pushing the trim back to the start whilst going forward thus minimizing the fiddling under stage 6 of the instructions - "Finishing touches".

    Craig, I was wondering how the new trim would stand up to our Aussie sun, I think you have aswered that that it is OK.

    I trust that the above will assist others tackling the Retrospecparts kit for refurbishing side mirror trims.


    John

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