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  1. #1
    Fellow Frogger! IE23's Avatar
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    Default Looking for a Citroen Mechanic

    If anyone knows a Mechanic in Melbourne who is;

    1. Trustworthy,
    2. Knowledgeable on DS, CX & Xantia (or even one of each),
    3. Honest about the time taken to complete the tasks,
    4. Efficient (can complete the required work within a reasonable time),
    5. Charges reasonably rates,
    6. Has a reasonable level of communication,
    7. Will use the correct parts,
    & 8. Does good work.

    Are my expectations too high or not high enough?

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    I genuinely will appreciate your thoughts and comments. Please let me know. PM me if you wish.


    Adrian

    _________________

    Current;

    Xantia V6 Exclusive Auto 2000


    Past;

    CX25 GTI Turbo series 1 1985
    DS23 IE Pallas 5sp 1974
    CX25ie Pallas Auto 1984 Parts
    2CV 1988
    CX25ie Pallas Auto 1984

  2. #2
    Thank God for my Hydroen harrisson_citroen's Avatar
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    Big ask, but.....

    If you really want all these qualities rolled into one, you'll have to drive up to Brisbane and visit the legendary DS Motors at Red Hill.


    DS Un jour, DS toujours !

    DS23 IE Pallas Automatique Borg Warner
    C5 X7 163 Exclusive Automatique AM6
    C3 II 2010 Automatique AL4
    Peugeot Boxer Van hired from T.....y, that was manual!
    and bloody good too!

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    Fellow Frogger! denxm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by harrisson_citroen View Post
    Big ask, but.....

    If you really want all these qualities rolled into one, you'll have to drive up to Brisbane and visit the legendary DS Motors at Red Hill.


    and the weather up here is really nice at the moment

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    Thank God for my Hydroen harrisson_citroen's Avatar
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    And........Uki in Queensland is really nice as well. I really like Uki and Tyalgum.
    DS Un jour, DS toujours !

    DS23 IE Pallas Automatique Borg Warner
    C5 X7 163 Exclusive Automatique AM6
    C3 II 2010 Automatique AL4
    Peugeot Boxer Van hired from T.....y, that was manual!
    and bloody good too!

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    And are the Cain Toads still spreading West?

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    Fellow Frogger! IE23's Avatar
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    LOL do the Cain Toads make good mechanics?

    Quote Originally Posted by pekay49 View Post
    And are the Cain Toads still spreading West?


    Adrian

    _________________

    Current;

    Xantia V6 Exclusive Auto 2000


    Past;

    CX25 GTI Turbo series 1 1985
    DS23 IE Pallas 5sp 1974
    CX25ie Pallas Auto 1984 Parts
    2CV 1988
    CX25ie Pallas Auto 1984

  7. #7
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    Can't help with the DS, but in regards to the CX & Xantia I can strongly recommend Elliot. Elliot is a Paris trained mechanic and has been fantastic looking after my Citroen C5 V6 in Mount Eliza.

    Although he is based in Frankston (SE Melbourne) he is a mobile mechanic so he'll come to you.

    As far as your critrea goes I've found him to be Trustworthy,. Knowledgeable Honest about the time taken to complete the tasks, Efficient (can complete the required work within a reasonable time), Charges reasonably rates, has a GREAT level of communication,
    will use the correct parts (and is happy to fit parts you supply) and does does good work

    To be honest Elliot has made owning a Citroen a joy when it comes to servicing

    You can get him on 0412 391 205
    Last edited by C5V6Kamikaze; 10th May 2013 at 10:01 AM.

  8. #8
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    Adrian,
    This is related more to D series.
    I doubt in Melbourne exists a person or company capable of meeting your expectations.
    These are specialist cars requiring knowledge and skill beyond the norm to deal effectively with a 40yo car which WILL have challenges even for the most experienced.
    These challenges when presented, take time to resolve, usually more time than less.

    For example. The DS23ie
    You drive in with a "leaking exhaust". It's only been leaking for a little while, as far as you can tell, and now it is annoying you, so time to have it fixed.
    After diagnosis, you are advised that the engine pipe to exhaust manifold is the source of the leak.

    So how much and how long to fix it?
    There is no short answer.

    When examining the exhaust, the flex pipe is on its last legs, the clamps are non genuine, the engine pipe to engine block clamp is also broken,one or two exhaust flange studs are broken or corroded, the flange nuts aren't the correct type. The engine pipe is corroded at the flange surfaces.
    The muffler outlet clamp to the tail pipes is also corroded, but not yet leaking, at least you have enjoyed a thorough examination.

    This requires the removal of the exhaust manifold AND the starter motor to repair.
    On a 40 year old engine, it is likely that at least one or two of the exhaust manifold studs will be compromised, requiring replacement. Of course the exhaust manifold to cylinder head gaskets will require replacement. It is also advisable, if the correct nuts and washers are not present to purchase a complete set of the correct type.

    The heat shield studs on the exhaust manifold probably are corroded and worn too, the threads past their best.
    The removal and replacement of these studs, on the exhaust manifold are tricky at best and most mechanics will have another specialist remove them, to avoid having to use a helicoil or similar. I know this because other mechanics have sent their manifolds to me for the removal and replacement of all the studs. The replacement of the studs on the manifolds can take 3-4 hours if there is a difficulty, at least 1 1/2 hours doing the job properly. I won't bore you with the details.

    As the exhaust has probably been leaking for a considerable time, the engine pipe could require replacement. A quality replacement pipe is difficult to find. The reproduction pipes available are simply sub standard and a compromise at best.
    Are you prepared to source the replacement pipe, or do you leave this up to the mechanic?
    You need flange gaskets, manifold gaskets a full set of studs for the manifolds and a set of nuts for the exhaust flange as well as a set of nuts and washers for the exhaust manifold.
    There is also the odd replacement stud on the cylinder head. if a stud is broken, or worse, loose and has damaged the thread, then a remedy has to be effected, with the cylinder head in place. Depending on the location of the compromised studs, a helicoil or thread replacement device might be the repair. if access is good, a machinist might make a stepped stud after the cylinder head has been tapped with a new thread, one size larger than the original. No helicoil to worry about breaking, dis-similar metal corrosion and heat cycle degradation.
    Right oh, now we have the exhaust manifold sorted and a replacement engine pipe.

    It's a good thing the exhaust manifold faces didn't require milling to face them back to a flat surface, that is another outsourced specialist procedure which might cost a further $200 or so. Most of that cost is in the setting up.

    Better order a new flex pipe, unless you have a good one, as well as a cylinder block to engine pipe clamp and a flex pipe to muffler clamp. While we're at it, let's replace the muffler outlet clamp to be on the safe side. That's along with the flange and manifold gaskets as well as the CORRECT studs, nuts and washers mentioned previously.
    Okay, does someone have ALL the correct parts in stock, in Melbourne? Probably not. Perhaps one or two of those components might require sourcing from overseas. So your car is off the road for maybe two weeks, the mechanic has to store your car, somewhere!

    The correct assembly of the exhaust manifolds and engine requires patience and technique as well as following procedure to avoid further leaks and the failure of the engine pipe to exhaust manifold joint. Just one person doing this task is a tedious one, an extra pair of hands up top can make the assembly easier. The manifolds and pipes have to be lined up exactly, not close, exactly.
    The mechanic also needs to have on hand the thread anti-seize paste and exhaust sealant to smear on a couple of surfaces.

    At the completion of the job there could be this cost
    Parts: $300-$400
    Outsourced Labour: removal and replacement of studs on the manifold and or the cylinder head, lets say another $150
    Mechanics Labour: 8-10 hours @ a friendly $70 per hour.

    BONUS: If you haven't already replaced your starter motor it won't cost you any more in labour and you can fit one of those lovely, smaller, efficient Valeo replacements. Haven't priced one lately, but figure on $4-500.

    You just spent over a grand, lost the use of your car for a couple of weeks and maybe feel you've been bent over of a piffling exhaust leak. It isn't the case.
    When the car is returned to you, the exhaust doesn't leak and it won't for a very long time to come, unless you park in the wrong place or try to jump gutters. if the muffler requires replacement there's no need to disturb this previous work.

    Most mechanics have been beaten down to finding the cheapest fix for the owner who has neither the understanding nor the wherewithal for the job to be done, "the right way'.
    The cheapest thing on a Citroen D series is usually the person behind the wheel!

    Please don't take this the wrong way Adrian. if you are prepared to pay for the time spent to do the job properly and correctly, you will be rewarded with a successful result.
    However, to find the person who performs to this level of competence is not easy.
    I often receive calls from people who are looking for the cheapest, quickest solution. They never enjoy what they hear from me.

    I hope this helps, it took quite a time to compose this reply and it is not intended to inflame anyone.

  9. #9
    1000+ Posts robmac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by richo View Post
    Adrian,
    This is related more to D series.
    I doubt in Melbourne exists a person or company capable of meeting your expectations.
    These are specialist cars requiring knowledge and skill beyond the norm to deal effectively with a 40yo car which WILL have challenges even for the most experienced.
    These challenges when presented, take time to resolve, usually more time than less.

    For example. The DS23ie
    You drive in with a "leaking exhaust". It's only been leaking for a little while, as far as you can tell, and now it is annoying you, so time to have it fixed.
    After diagnosis, you are advised that the engine pipe to exhaust manifold is the source of the leak.

    So how much and how long to fix it?
    There is no short answer.

    When examining the exhaust, the flex pipe is on its last legs, the clamps are non genuine, the engine pipe to engine block clamp is also broken,one or two exhaust flange studs are broken or corroded, the flange nuts aren't the correct type. The engine pipe is corroded at the flange surfaces.
    The muffler outlet clamp to the tail pipes is also corroded, but not yet leaking, at least you have enjoyed a thorough examination.

    This requires the removal of the exhaust manifold AND the starter motor to repair.
    On a 40 year old engine, it is likely that at least one or two of the exhaust manifold studs will be compromised, requiring replacement. Of course the exhaust manifold to cylinder head gaskets will require replacement. It is also advisable, if the correct nuts and washers are not present to purchase a complete set of the correct type.

    The heat shield studs on the exhaust manifold probably are corroded and worn too, the threads past their best.
    The removal and replacement of these studs, on the exhaust manifold are tricky at best and most mechanics will have another specialist remove them, to avoid having to use a helicoil or similar. I know this because other mechanics have sent their manifolds to me for the removal and replacement of all the studs. The replacement of the studs on the manifolds can take 3-4 hours if there is a difficulty, at least 1 1/2 hours doing the job properly. I won't bore you with the details.

    As the exhaust has probably been leaking for a considerable time, the engine pipe could require replacement. A quality replacement pipe is difficult to find. The reproduction pipes available are simply sub standard and a compromise at best.
    Are you prepared to source the replacement pipe, or do you leave this up to the mechanic?
    You need flange gaskets, manifold gaskets a full set of studs for the manifolds and a set of nuts for the exhaust flange as well as a set of nuts and washers for the exhaust manifold.
    There is also the odd replacement stud on the cylinder head. if a stud is broken, or worse, loose and has damaged the thread, then a remedy has to be effected, with the cylinder head in place. Depending on the location of the compromised studs, a helicoil or thread replacement device might be the repair. if access is good, a machinist might make a stepped stud after the cylinder head has been tapped with a new thread, one size larger than the original. No helicoil to worry about breaking, dis-similar metal corrosion and heat cycle degradation.
    Right oh, now we have the exhaust manifold sorted and a replacement engine pipe.

    It's a good thing the exhaust manifold faces didn't require milling to face them back to a flat surface, that is another outsourced specialist procedure which might cost a further $200 or so. Most of that cost is in the setting up.

    Better order a new flex pipe, unless you have a good one, as well as a cylinder block to engine pipe clamp and a flex pipe to muffler clamp. While we're at it, let's replace the muffler outlet clamp to be on the safe side. That's along with the flange and manifold gaskets as well as the CORRECT studs, nuts and washers mentioned previously.
    Okay, does someone have ALL the correct parts in stock, in Melbourne? Probably not. Perhaps one or two of those components might require sourcing from overseas. So your car is off the road for maybe two weeks, the mechanic has to store your car, somewhere!

    The correct assembly of the exhaust manifolds and engine requires patience and technique as well as following procedure to avoid further leaks and the failure of the engine pipe to exhaust manifold joint. Just one person doing this task is a tedious one, an extra pair of hands up top can make the assembly easier. The manifolds and pipes have to be lined up exactly, not close, exactly.
    The mechanic also needs to have on hand the thread anti-seize paste and exhaust sealant to smear on a couple of surfaces.

    At the completion of the job there could be this cost
    Parts: $300-$400
    Outsourced Labour: removal and replacement of studs on the manifold and or the cylinder head, lets say another $150
    Mechanics Labour: 8-10 hours @ a friendly $70 per hour.

    BONUS: If you haven't already replaced your starter motor it won't cost you any more in labour and you can fit one of those lovely, smaller, efficient Valeo replacements. Haven't priced one lately, but figure on $4-500.

    You just spent over a grand, lost the use of your car for a couple of weeks and maybe feel you've been bent over of a piffling exhaust leak. It isn't the case.
    When the car is returned to you, the exhaust doesn't leak and it won't for a very long time to come, unless you park in the wrong place or try to jump gutters. if the muffler requires replacement there's no need to disturb this previous work.

    Most mechanics have been beaten down to finding the cheapest fix for the owner who has neither the understanding nor the wherewithal for the job to be done, "the right way'.
    The cheapest thing on a Citroen D series is usually the person behind the wheel!

    Please don't take this the wrong way Adrian. if you are prepared to pay for the time spent to do the job properly and correctly, you will be rewarded with a successful result.
    However, to find the person who performs to this level of competence is not easy.
    I often receive calls from people who are looking for the cheapest, quickest solution. They never enjoy what they hear from me.

    I hope this helps, it took quite a time to compose this reply and it is not intended to inflame anyone.
    About three years ago I made the mistake of taking on some service work for a close family friends 404. The car had "restored to bare metal" according to the owner.

    Just to clarify, in no way I am attempting to compare a 404 to the Citroen mechanically or any other way. But the experience that Richo mentions is very similar.

    I was asked "to sort the car out" and make it 100% as good to drive as when it was new.

    The total bill came to around $5k, which included a full brake reco, full suspension reco, engine liners set and bearings, cylinder head reco and hard seats. radiator recore, etc etc and no labour charge. I thought this was bargain but the owner was horrified initially. Until I pointed out the "bare metal" recondition was no more than a rust repair and repaint and re trim (a nice job) but no mechanical issues had been properly addressed.

    I spent as much time fixing previous mechanic "patches and cludges" as sorting things out.

    I spent around 4 weeks full time doing the work and finding parts and charged nought.

    Repairing or restoring 40 year cars is not a job for a mechanic, but rather a zealot with with deep pockets.

  10. #10
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Richo ... mate ... she'll be right...

    Those sheered off studs, just drill them out ... off center and use some chinese bolts from supercheap to hold them together. Re-use the old gaskets with plenty exhaust goo...... same with all the connections. Just overtighten all the other manifold head studs and use plenty of maniseal around the sheered off head studs...... Some electric bog will fix up all the exhaust components .... big worm drive hose clamps and cut open tin cans with plenty of exhaust goo will fix broken flexi-pipes....

    she'll be right mate

    seeya,
    Shane L.
    'Cit' homepage:
    Citroen Workshop
    Proper cars--
    '85 Series II CX2500 GTi Turbo I
    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/citro%EBn-forum/90325-best-project-car-you-have-ever-seen.html
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


    Modern Junk:
    '07 Poogoe 407 HDi 6spd manual

  11. #11
    Fellow Frogger! IE23's Avatar
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    People reading this realise it's a hypothetical situation you have used here;

    Quote Originally Posted by richo View Post
    Adrian,
    This is related more to D series.
    I doubt in Melbourne exists a person or company capable of meeting your expectations.
    These are specialist cars requiring knowledge and skill beyond the norm to deal effectively with a 40yo car which WILL have challenges even for the most experienced.
    These challenges when presented, take time to resolve, usually more time than less.

    For example. The DS23ie
    You drive in with a "leaking exhaust". It's only been leaking for a little while, as far as you can tell, and now it is annoying you, so time to have it fixed.
    After diagnosis, you are advised that the engine pipe to exhaust manifold is the source of the leak.

    So how much and how long to fix it?
    There is no short answer.

    When examining the exhaust, the flex pipe is on its last legs, the clamps are non genuine, the engine pipe to engine block clamp is also broken,one or two exhaust flange studs are broken or corroded, the flange nuts aren't the correct type. The engine pipe is corroded at the flange surfaces.
    The muffler outlet clamp to the tail pipes is also corroded, but not yet leaking, at least you have enjoyed a thorough examination.

    This requires the removal of the exhaust manifold AND the starter motor to repair.
    On a 40 year old engine, it is likely that at least one or two of the exhaust manifold studs will be compromised, requiring replacement. Of course the exhaust manifold to cylinder head gaskets will require replacement. It is also advisable, if the correct nuts and washers are not present to purchase a complete set of the correct type.

    The heat shield studs on the exhaust manifold probably are corroded and worn too, the threads past their best.
    The removal and replacement of these studs, on the exhaust manifold are tricky at best and most mechanics will have another specialist remove them, to avoid having to use a helicoil or similar. I know this because other mechanics have sent their manifolds to me for the removal and replacement of all the studs. The replacement of the studs on the manifolds can take 3-4 hours if there is a difficulty, at least 1 1/2 hours doing the job properly. I won't bore you with the details.

    As the exhaust has probably been leaking for a considerable time, the engine pipe could require replacement. A quality replacement pipe is difficult to find. The reproduction pipes available are simply sub standard and a compromise at best.
    Are you prepared to source the replacement pipe, or do you leave this up to the mechanic?
    You need flange gaskets, manifold gaskets a full set of studs for the manifolds and a set of nuts for the exhaust flange as well as a set of nuts and washers for the exhaust manifold.
    There is also the odd replacement stud on the cylinder head. if a stud is broken, or worse, loose and has damaged the thread, then a remedy has to be effected, with the cylinder head in place. Depending on the location of the compromised studs, a helicoil or thread replacement device might be the repair. if access is good, a machinist might make a stepped stud after the cylinder head has been tapped with a new thread, one size larger than the original. No helicoil to worry about breaking, dis-similar metal corrosion and heat cycle degradation.
    Right oh, now we have the exhaust manifold sorted and a replacement engine pipe.

    It's a good thing the exhaust manifold faces didn't require milling to face them back to a flat surface, that is another outsourced specialist procedure which might cost a further $200 or so. Most of that cost is in the setting up.

    Better order a new flex pipe, unless you have a good one, as well as a cylinder block to engine pipe clamp and a flex pipe to muffler clamp. While we're at it, let's replace the muffler outlet clamp to be on the safe side. That's along with the flange and manifold gaskets as well as the CORRECT studs, nuts and washers mentioned previously.
    Okay, does someone have ALL the correct parts in stock, in Melbourne? Probably not. Perhaps one or two of those components might require sourcing from overseas. So your car is off the road for maybe two weeks, the mechanic has to store your car, somewhere!

    The correct assembly of the exhaust manifolds and engine requires patience and technique as well as following procedure to avoid further leaks and the failure of the engine pipe to exhaust manifold joint. Just one person doing this task is a tedious one, an extra pair of hands up top can make the assembly easier. The manifolds and pipes have to be lined up exactly, not close, exactly.
    The mechanic also needs to have on hand the thread anti-seize paste and exhaust sealant to smear on a couple of surfaces.

    At the completion of the job there could be this cost
    Parts: $300-$400
    Outsourced Labour: removal and replacement of studs on the manifold and or the cylinder head, lets say another $150
    Mechanics Labour: 8-10 hours @ a friendly $70 per hour.

    BONUS: If you haven't already replaced your starter motor it won't cost you any more in labour and you can fit one of those lovely, smaller, efficient Valeo replacements. Haven't priced one lately, but figure on $4-500.

    You just spent over a grand, lost the use of your car for a couple of weeks and maybe feel you've been bent over of a piffling exhaust leak. It isn't the case.
    When the car is returned to you, the exhaust doesn't leak and it won't for a very long time to come, unless you park in the wrong place or try to jump gutters. if the muffler requires replacement there's no need to disturb this previous work.

    Most mechanics have been beaten down to finding the cheapest fix for the owner who has neither the understanding nor the wherewithal for the job to be done, "the right way'.
    The cheapest thing on a Citroen D series is usually the person behind the wheel!

    Please don't take this the wrong way Adrian. if you are prepared to pay for the time spent to do the job properly and correctly, you will be rewarded with a successful result.
    However, to find the person who performs to this level of competence is not easy.
    I often receive calls from people who are looking for the cheapest, quickest solution. They never enjoy what they hear from me.

    I hope this helps, it took quite a time to compose this reply and it is not intended to inflame anyone.


    Adrian

    _________________

    Current;

    Xantia V6 Exclusive Auto 2000


    Past;

    CX25 GTI Turbo series 1 1985
    DS23 IE Pallas 5sp 1974
    CX25ie Pallas Auto 1984 Parts
    2CV 1988
    CX25ie Pallas Auto 1984

  12. #12
    Fellow Frogger! mberry's Avatar
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    Well..........
    I can attest to the scenario Richo has painted, albeit my starter was the culprit. The process proceeded as he outlined. Unfortunately I didn't have the luxury of the starter giving up while the car was conveniently located at home. I had to work on the car in the garage at the office on a sloping floor, which further complicated the whole job. After removing all the components that block access to the manifold, I found studs were seized, all new studs, nuts and gaskets were sourced from O.S. Apparently I managed to find the last known original clutch gear in captivity for the original Ducelier starter motor, again that was sourced O.S. Engine pipe was found locally.
    To cut a long story short the car was layed up for 2 months. The parts bill exceeded $1000. but included having a auto electrician rebuild starter with the parts I sourced, and I did get the exhaust manifold and engine pipe ceramic coated while I was in there. Ok, roughly 30 hours labour. It is a long job to undertake on a DS, and probably my least favourite, but madness not to attend to everything at that time. On other DS's I have done the rear engine mounts as part of this job but, that was one thing I didn't need to do this time.
    ........ And I think that is the point, when working on a D solving one problem normal requires you to perform preventative maintenance in other areas at the same time. I would have had a heart attack if I had to pay for labour on top. No wonder it's hard to find a "good" mechanic. They all seem expensive sooner or later and they get forced into cutting corners trying to keep customers happy.

  13. #13
    Real cars have hydraulics DoubleChevron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IE23 View Post
    People reading this realise it's a hypothetical situation you have used here;
    I'd call it "almost standard" ....... Old exhaust are always "fun" in my experiance.
    'Cit' homepage:
    Citroen Workshop
    Proper cars--
    '85 Series II CX2500 GTi Turbo I
    '63 ID19 http://www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/showthread.php?t=90325
    '72 DS21 ie 5spd pallas (last looked at ... about 15years ago)
    '78 GS1220 pallas
    '92 Range Rover Classic ... 5spd manual.

    Yay ... No Slugomatics


    Modern Junk:
    '07 Poogoe 407 HDi 6spd manual

  14. #14
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    Sounds about right. Unless they've been replaced fairly recently, you can count on needing to replace a few studs and the nuts in any or all of the places Richo mentioned. Most of the correct fasteners and clamps are readily available for very little, so it's worth buying a few parts prior to the job and undertaking preventative work and avoiding the breakdown scenario. Many cars have lost the clamp between the sump and the downpipe, so that's another factor, but it comes with the exhaust fitting kit most of the usual vendors carry.

    It shouldn't be open slather for a huge bill, but the reality of a 40 year old car, even a now 13+ year old Xantia or BX, is that you touch one thing and three others can break on you. There's a reason most people use a new car every day. It's also why workshops geared to a fast turnaround avoid old models even though they are capable of dealing with them.

  15. #15
    VIP Sponsor richo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IE23 View Post
    People reading this realise it's a hypothetical situation you have used here;
    No Adrian, this is not hypothetical at all.
    I've experienced this scenario, twice now on my own cars and once on another.
    The most recent included the purchase of a pair of NOS manifolds, mine were stuffed. As well as a spare set I had milled.
    The manifolds alone cost.........
    $800

    Every time I hear a leaking exhaust on a D (which is probably half of them) I shudder inside.

    The cars are 40+ years old now and MOST in the past have had at least one bodge in that area somewhere along the way.

    Michael is correct, you do the job properly, either yourself (in our cases), or you the owner pays for the labour. The time it takes to complete is the time it takes. Actually working on these cars can be fraught with more complex situations than the owners imagine.
    Last edited by richo; 10th May 2013 at 01:11 AM.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by richo View Post
    Adrian,
    This is related more to D series.

    ......

    When examining the exhaust, the flex pipe is on its last legs, the clamps are non genuine, the engine pipe to engine block clamp is also broken,one or two exhaust flange studs are broken or corroded, the flange nuts aren't the correct type. The engine pipe is corroded at the flange surfaces.
    The muffler outlet clamp to the tail pipes is also corroded, but not yet leaking, at least you have enjoyed a thorough examination.

    This requires the removal of the exhaust manifold AND the starter motor to repair.
    On a 40 year old engine, it is likely that at least one or two of the exhaust manifold studs will be compromised, requiring replacement. Of course the exhaust manifold to cylinder head gaskets will require replacement. It is also advisable, if the correct nuts and washers are not present to purchase a complete set of the correct type.

    The heat shield studs on the exhaust manifold probably are corroded and worn too, the threads past their best.

    .....
    LOL Richo, you've been peeking under my bonnet, haven't you! You forgot to mention, the broken studs will be the rear ones that are the hardest to get to and most difficult to work on, and broken off flush with the head.....i WILL be asking for tips about this in coming months....

    cheers leconte
    1962 Heidelberg ID19 "Axel"
    1965 Heidelberg ID19
    half owner 1974 GS 1220 Convertisseur Break

  17. #17
    Fellow Frogger! Techbuy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by richo View Post
    Adrian,
    This is related more to D series.
    I doubt in Melbourne exists a person or company capable of meeting your expectations.
    These are specialist cars requiring knowledge and skill beyond the norm to deal effectively with a 40yo car which WILL have challenges even for the most experienced.
    These challenges when presented, take time to resolve, usually more time than less.

    For example. The DS23ie
    However, to find the person who performs to this level of competence is not easy.
    Well said Richo, this is just typical of getting things done on these 40 year old cars, I think you have the experience to help us weekend restorers and get a grip on what we face looking after our passion.

    The cost of getting things done "without cutting corners or on the cheap" is very high and why most of the people who own classic cars have to do so much themselves or have to try to win Lotto to cover the costs.

    While this is about repairing 40 year old cars, I thought I might add a note about a chat with a fellow Citroen owner about restoration costs and we estimated for a "do most of it yourself" restoration it can cost as much as $40,000 with a full pint job and if you get it done by a restorer then easily $70,000 and still counting. ( this is doing it "Right" and full restore).

    P.S s Richo, sorry I abbreviated your excellent reply...

    Cheers
    Colin
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    1975 DS23 IE Pallas Auto
    1972 D Special 4Sp
    1/2 a DS23 Auto
    www.ds23.com.au
    Had a 1974 D Special 4Sp (by now reborn as a Toaster)

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by IE23 View Post
    If anyone knows a Mechanic in Melbourne who is;

    1. Trustworthy,
    2. Knowledgeable on DS, CX & Xantia (or even one of each),
    3. Honest about the time taken to complete the tasks,
    4. Efficient (can complete the required work within a reasonable time),
    5. Charges reasonably rates,
    6. Has a reasonable level of communication,
    7. Will use the correct parts,
    & 8. Does good work.

    Are my expectations too high or not high enough?

    I genuinely will appreciate your thoughts and comments. Please let me know. PM me if you wish.
    This is a sad state of affairs, that in a city as big as Melbourne, there isn't a decent workshop to look after these wonderful cars.

    ??????????? !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    John Paas.

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    I use Paris Motors in Richmond for my CX and have found them to be good.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by HERBYJ View Post
    I use Paris Motors in Richmond for my CX and have found them to be good.
    I did try Paris Motors last week for the first time. Now you would think they would be interested in a potential new customer but that is not the experience I had. They took my car kept it for a week, did nothing and they were never available to speak to and didn't have the courtesy to return one phone call. After a week of this I gave up and collected my car, still without any communication. This experience put me off completely!


    Adrian

    _________________

    Current;

    Xantia V6 Exclusive Auto 2000


    Past;

    CX25 GTI Turbo series 1 1985
    DS23 IE Pallas 5sp 1974
    CX25ie Pallas Auto 1984 Parts
    2CV 1988
    CX25ie Pallas Auto 1984

  21. #21
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    Sorry to hear about your experience with Paris.
    As I said I've found them to be good but not perfect, their communication could be better.
    Also, I think Joe (who is the the main guy) has been away on holidays and has been sick recently.
    The other mechanic that others recommend is Cars of France but I've never used them.

  22. #22
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    Sorry to hear about your experience with Paris.
    As I said I've found them to be good but not perfect, their communication could be better.
    Also, I think Joe (who is the the main guy) has been away on holidays and has been sick recently.
    The other mechanic that others recommend is Cars of France but I've never used them.

  23. #23
    VIP Sponsor David Cavanagh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IE23 View Post
    I did try Paris Motors last week for the first time. Now you would think they would be interested in a potential new customer but that is not the experience I had. They took my car kept it for a week, did nothing and they were never available to speak to and didn't have the courtesy to return one phone call. After a week of this I gave up and collected my car, still without any communication. This experience put me off completely!

    Joe has been very sick in hospital the past couple of weeks (he really did come close to death) a customer found him collapsed on the floor at work so maybe give them another chance.
    David Cavanagh

    FRENCH CONNECTION / PEUGEO WRECKING / RENOSPARES / CITROWRECK

    03 9338 8191 or 03 93354008

    34 KING St
    AIRPORT WEST
    VIC 3042


    frenchconnect@bigpond.com

    https://www.facebook.com/FrenchConect

  24. #24
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    I might be in the dark here but on this Froggy site - -

    is there a Thread or info section compiling all the Citroen workshops in Australia?

    If there isn't, maybe it can be done - - maybe in the top area of Specialised/ Tech Corner

    I have always thought that cars are kept on the roads if there are workshops and mechanics around interested to work on them - -

    - - no workshop - - cars die.

    This is not saying that some cars are kept alive by whizz kids like here on Aussie Frogs but there are many out there that love to own an old car but have not the time or expertise to work on them themselves.

    John Paas.

  25. #25
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    I sincerely hope Joe gets well and things improve there for all us old car owners who are non home tinkerers.

    maybe I better learn to do my own work, just need a garage, special tools, time, knowledge and patience. Sadly however I'm lacking in all these areas.

    Quote Originally Posted by David Cavanagh View Post
    Joe has been very sick in hospital the past couple of weeks (he really did come close to death) a customer found him collapsed on the floor at work so maybe give them another chance.


    Adrian

    _________________

    Current;

    Xantia V6 Exclusive Auto 2000


    Past;

    CX25 GTI Turbo series 1 1985
    DS23 IE Pallas 5sp 1974
    CX25ie Pallas Auto 1984 Parts
    2CV 1988
    CX25ie Pallas Auto 1984

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